The Quest To Find Raxxla

[Rochester]

So, one particular reference in this link is to Erebus. Which also happens to be an anarchy system in the bubble and sort of in the search area indicated by Drakkster story.

I went there and it's a 5 star system with no planetary bodies. I decided to FSS the signal sources, and ran into a signal source ~300k LS out of the entrance which expired just as I targeted it and exit FSS so unfortunately I have no direction on it right now. So I'm sitting in Erebus now to see if it shows up again (to be clear - there is NOTHING in this system 300k LS away from the entrance by the normal books and I'm not flying randomly around in there that far out).

Edit: so apparently they do pop up pretty far away - I found one 60k LS from the nearest body. And unfortunately in this case it doesn't lead to anything.

Erebus is a key system within my Miltonian model theory.

In Paradise Lost when the gates of hell are opened the noise is so loud it shakes the depths of Chaos. Which Milton denotes as Erebus.

In my theory Erebus aligns along an axis with the Thetis signal and the gen ship Artemis. This I believe to be accurate because the extended path aligns perfectly with the path of Jacques, thus I believe Erebus is upon the lowest area or rim of the zone of Chaos.

The pavilion of Chaos
https://forums.frontier.co.uk/threads/the-quest-to-find-raxxla.168253/post-10329794

The path of Jacques
https://forums.frontier.co.uk/threads/the-quest-to-find-raxxla.168253/post-10304929

 

[Philip Coutts]

Well for no reason other than something to do I'm off to have a poke around the Jewel Box Sectors, because well it has Jewel in it...

 

[SHEA PARDH]

You have to forgive us but I don't think most of us have read Paradise Lost. Also, it's largely just retelling of the Book of Genesis.

I don't understand how you draw the connection between Paradise Lost and Jacques Station. I believe the Jacques transit is largely in game to facilitate Thargoid arc and creation of Colonia - it has already plenty of functions on its own.

Paradise Lost vs Raxxla is defiinitely a possibility, but if we assume that Erebus is the "gates of hell" and that the "gates of hell" and "gates of heaven" are equidistant from Earth then this sort of makes for a rather trivial concept of simply looking someplace with opposite coordinates to Erebus. Erebus is at -50.5 / -49 / 27.40625 which imples that the "gates of heaven" would be at 50 / 49 / -27 so somewhere like Nephthys, or if we assume that this is meant to be vertically up then -50 / 50 / 27 so around Wolf 750. Or you can pick another mirror plane / point, and regardless this all lands within +/-100 / +/-100 / +/-100 coordinate box which has been extremely throughly scanned by the Raxxla Potato Hunt project.

If we mean for this to be further out, then this presents numerous problems.

 

[Rochester]

You have to forgive us but I don't think most of us have read Paradise Lost. Also, it's largely just retelling of the Book of Genesis.

I don't understand how you draw the connection between Paradise Lost and Jacques Station. I believe the Jacques transit is largely in game to facilitate Thargoid arc and creation of Colonia - it has already plenty of functions on its own.

Paradise Lost vs Raxxla is defiinitely a possibility, but if we assume that Erebus is the "gates of hell" and that the "gates of hell" and "gates of heaven" are equidistant from Earth then this sort of makes for a rather trivial concept of simply looking someplace with opposite coordinates to Erebus. Erebus is at -50.5 / -49 / 27.40625 which imples that the "gates of heaven" would be at 50 / 49 / -27 so somewhere like Nephthys, or if we assume that this is meant to be vertically up then -50 / 50 / 27 so around Wolf 750. Or you can pick another mirror plane / point, and regardless this all lands within +/-100 / +/-100 / +/-100 coordinate box which has been extremely throughly scanned by the Raxxla Potato Hunt project.

If we mean for this to be further out, then this presents numerous problems.

No worries this is a peculiar hypothesis.

Firstly Paradise Lost is not simply retelling the book of Genesis it is by far much broader than that. Milton actually mixed and expertly brought together several religious and scientific theologies and theories to build his own unique fictional universe.

Yes it is thick text to read, in the same context as many 1600/1700 texts are. I was taught classics at school and yes even we found it boring. However we were taught it for linguistic construction / poetic contextualisation, not science nor theology.

I begun re-reading Paradise Lost once I really got into Raxxla and began to understand just how much Micheal Brookes loved this text, and then begun to reappraise the text from a scientific perspective.

I am by education and trade someone who employs GIS and temporal mapping, not least behavioural mapping. For years I refused to use my ‘work’ mind on this game, opting instead for fun. So yes there could well be a semblance of scholarly bias.

I drew the conclusion between Jacques and Satan indirectly.

One came before the other, then I began to see connections, all that time aware it was only an assumption. When I noticed the identified in game alignment I cannot in good conscience ignore just how coincidental it truly is; given the connections it seemed therefore based upon the calculation to be highly likely.

Highly likely is not a certainty. I want others to challenge this or corroborate it because I’m aware there’s room here for error. Although in the absence of anything else I’m drawn more towards certainty, so I’m always seeking validation O7

I keep banging on about Jacques mirroring the path of Satan because there does seem to be a logic to these systems placements, especially in regards to other models I suspect exist in game which together support one another, maybe it is wistful thinking?

Paradise Lost is above others a brilliant example of orientational writing, where the author provides signposts and builds perspectives to convey a 3 dimensional universe.

Erebus is not the gates of hell, but likely close to them they represent the lowest part of chaos. In game I don’t believe the author has established every aspect and is using a very broad palette to specifically avoid making it too obvious.

Jacques was not originally destined for his current objective, it’s confirmed by Brookes and Drew there was an alternative narrative which got dropped in favour of an emerging player driven story, FD repurposed it.

In truth the assessment of the equal distance between the gates is correct. However the gates of heaven were not at the location of Paradise.

These gates were on the east wall but by the description and various studies were indicated to be parallel to Eden. Which may have been more towards the North East?

I am also seeing around Thetis and other area an allusion towards an Eastern direction, so I am split upon its veracity in that regard, but singularly I cant escape the bizarre alignment between Erebus and Thetis, so my assumption is there’s more here than meets the eye and we’re missing something…

 

[SHEA PARDH]

Thanks for the explanation. I think that we can probably exclude anything that lands us within the Raxxla Potato Search boundary of 200 LY from SOL. Either they find it, or there are prerequisites that mean they won't and we wouldn't either unless we identify the prerequisites, or it's simply not there.

I strongly suspect that Drakkster by some sheer luck wound up somewhere at least strongly related if not THE place (maybe TDW station, maybe something similar). For instance, if this was something related to a body on a highly excentric orbit that is not immediately scannable, Drakkster could have had once in a lifetime chance to run into this as the body was close to the star and the next time could be 20 years from now so unless we have pretty good certainty where to look, we might not actually find it by scanning systems. Otherwise how do you find an unscannable planet? The only ways I can immediately think of is that either there would be an unexpected concentration of signal sources around it OR you'd have to identify it visually by observing its parallax against background stars while moving in supercruise in the system. The signal sources are sort of doable at random, but unless one would look for that, I doubt anyone would just happen to see that, and the parallax method would require absolutely knowing at least which system to look into.

It's possible that since then the whole thing was moved / removed as maybe it was a forgotten plot piece of the plot that got scrapped, and since Drakkster left the system without much of a record on what happened, FDEV just scrapped the place. If that's the case, it's possible you're seeing correct things that may however lead to nowhere as the game direction changed.

According to this, Raxxla was in use by INRA:

Raxxla - Elite Wiki

wiki.alioth.net

This is not ED canon, but INRA itself is:

Intergalactic Naval Reserve Arm

The Intergalactic Naval Reserve Arm, commonly known as INRA, was a clandestine paramilitary organization established as a joint Federal-Imperial initiative in 3125.[2] While little is publicly known about INRA, surviving reports from the time indicate it was created to address Thargoid...

elite-dangerous.fandom.com

(that's basically our whole story line up to this point).

Now we're post 2nd Thargoid War. Are we going to see re-emergence of INRA (possibly under new name since the current galactic powers denounced the original)? Maybe Raxxla location will be found from some references yet to be discovered within existing or yet to be found INRA records.

Another option is that we're not following the original INRA storyline exactly, and Raxxla is in the hands of some very shadowy figures. Is there an ingame faction extremely populated by Elite NPCs (which would be consistent with the original story)? I have to say that so far I haven't run into any obvious concentration of Elite NPCs. One here, one there, nothing super obviously standing out.

 

[Rochester]

Thanks for the explanation. I think that we can probably exclude anything that lands us within the Raxxla Potato Search boundary of 200 LY from SOL. Either they find it, or there are prerequisites that mean they won't and we wouldn't either unless we identify the prerequisites, or it's simply not there.

I strongly suspect that Drakkster by some sheer luck wound up somewhere at least strongly related if not THE place (maybe TDW station, maybe something similar). For instance, if this was something related to a body on a highly excentric orbit that is not immediately scannable, Drakkster could have had once in a lifetime chance to run into this as the body was close to the star and the next time could be 20 years from now so unless we have pretty good certainty where to look, we might not actually find it by scanning systems. Otherwise how do you find an unscannable planet? The only ways I can immediately think of is that either there would be an unexpected concentration of signal sources around it OR you'd have to identify it visually by observing its parallax against background stars while moving in supercruise in the system. The signal sources are sort of doable at random, but unless one would look for that, I doubt anyone would just happen to see that, and the parallax method would require absolutely knowing at least which system to look into.

It's possible that since then the whole thing was moved / removed as maybe it was a forgotten plot piece of the plot that got scrapped, and since Drakkster left the system without much of a record on what happened, FDEV just scrapped the place. If that's the case, it's possible you're seeing correct things that may however lead to nowhere as the game direction changed.

According to this, Raxxla was in use by INRA:

Raxxla - Elite Wiki

wiki.alioth.net

This is not ED canon, but INRA itself is:

Intergalactic Naval Reserve Arm

The Intergalactic Naval Reserve Arm, commonly known as INRA, was a clandestine paramilitary organization established as a joint Federal-Imperial initiative in 3125.[2] While little is publicly known about INRA, surviving reports from the time indicate it was created to address Thargoid...

elite-dangerous.fandom.com

(that's basically our whole story line up to this point).

Now we're post 2nd Thargoid War. Are we going to see re-emergence of INRA (possibly under new name since the current galactic powers denounced the original)? Maybe Raxxla location will be found from some references yet to be discovered within existing or yet to be found INRA records.

Another option is that we're not following the original INRA storyline exactly, and Raxxla is in the hands of some very shadowy figures. Is there an ingame faction extremely populated by Elite NPCs (which would be consistent with the original story)? I have to say that so far I haven't run into any obvious concentration of Elite NPCs. One here, one there, nothing super obviously standing out.

I’ve a strong suspicion there does exist the possibility of a redundant narrative and such evidence may be simply archeological in nature.

We know they scrapped the original DW missions, they confirmed it was a story. Such stories would have had some in game elements to hold it up. I strongly suspect such examples were part of an original narrative and the Codex alludes to it.

 

[RyloTerrik]

These gates were on the east wall but by the description and various studies were indicated to be parallel to Eden. Which may have been more towards the North East?

I am also seeing around Thetis and other area an allusion towards an Eastern direction, so I am split upon its veracity in that regard, but singularly Incant escape the bizarre alignment between Erebus and Thetis, so my assumption is there’s more here than meets the eye and we’re missing something…

That is probably because early world maps, influenced by Christian theology, were oriented towards the East as opposed to the North as we do now. Eden was East (top) and Jerusalem was at the center. The Hereford Mappa Mundi is very detailed. https://www.themappamundi.co.uk/

 

[Rochester]

In the text the compass alignment is seen from the perspective of gods field of view. So Milton very likely ascribed his compass points with theological reasoning behind them.

Oh, My Stars: A New Map of the Universe in Paradise Lost.
Michael R. Coats - 2020 Masters Thesis.

Oh, My Stars: A New Map of the Universe in Paradise Lost

Milton’s geographical descriptions in Paradise Lost are heavily influenced by his fascination with maps. Furthermore, his design of the universe in Paradise Lost follows a cartographic style that has led to several attempts at mapping it. These attempts, however, have followed the erroneous...

aquila.usm.edu

 

[Rochester]

In context to such a hypothesis, given where Satan first ascended. Where would you place the Greek Fates?

These don’t appear with Paradise Lost however they do occur in game around Helios, which was attributed as the most northern placed god.

So I’m of the opinion that they and for that matter the Thetis signal are at the apex of the zone of Chaos in game. If so it could be imagined as the point where Satan emerged from Chaos?

In Paradise Lost Milton alludes to Eden being close to the Eastern gate but not directly under it. The character chaos told Satan ‘not far off the place where you first fell’ that being the north wall of the Empyrean. So could Eden (Raxxla) be towards the North East?

The following shows numerous systems named after various deities, layered over the Greek Fate, The Norse Norns and Thetis, and I’ve drawn certain alignments between the Greek wind gods, which I believe advocates a Miltonian compass.

Could this then be someplace between Osiris and Boann?

 

[Tifu]

I've mapped thousands of bodies with G5 engineered scanner only to now find out that the broker one is not only simpler to get but also literally twice as good - maps 6-efficiency bodies with 2 probes.

Having experienced having to map some gas giants with 17-19 probes, this module will be a big relief. Now at least I won't have to debate as to whether to map something or not

 

[Tifu]

In the text the compass alignment is seen from the perspective of gods field of view. So Milton very likely ascribed his compass points with theological reasoning behind them.

I think it's time to quit procrastinating and read Paradise Lost from end to end. Not getting any younger, and this is definitely in my bucket list

 

[Tifu]

An old Reddit thread on why Raaxla is much closer to Sol than people think. Nice recap of the evolution and limits of hyperdrive technology.

Raxxla is 100% somewhere in the Bubble, and I have proof.

 

[Tifu]

source: https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/26?msg=welcome_stranger

 

[SHEA PARDH]

An old Reddit thread on why Raaxla is much closer to Sol than people think. Nice recap of the evolution and limits of hyperdrive technology.

Raxxla is 100% somewhere in the Bubble, and I have proof.

Yes, the fact that this predates FSD is the main argument this should be within the bubble or very close by. That being said, FDEV might not actually care about it.

Here are counterpoints:

1. It would be way too easy and it means Raxxla is basically a fancy tourist beacon.

2. Even if it originally was there, after the initial story plan blew up, if I was in charge of that, I'd move it. Where? Who knows, but it probably wouldn't be within the legacy drive range anymore.

3. It's trivial to explain why Raxxla isn't where "it's supposed to be" - according to lore the planet could be moved - it was literally one of it's main features, and the planet wasn't even in our galaxy per se but let's say it is. If it's not actually a planet but a gateway, then even more so it's very movable. If it's some other kind of artifact, even more likely.

4. What's the point of having 400 billion star systems if only a few hundred actually matter? They kind of got out of that with Colonia a little, but that still means that we're talking the bubble and a much smaller bubble, and a handful of things on the way in and out - the rest is a fancy wallpaper. The bubble is ~100k systems so basically something like 10^-5 of a percent of the universe. The greatest artifact of the universe just happens to be in the bubble...

5. There is no canonical proof that anyone ever has actually found the thing, much less used it in any shape or form. The codex entry mentions original story as "Cora [...] claims she's found a map to some pirate stash [...]. Maybe we should go FIND RAXXLA while we're at it!" So Raxxla in 2296 is a myth, it's not THE pirate stash, and just some legend about some unspecified awesome thing - there is no real reason it was findable.

Paradoxically, the most concrete, credible part of the codex talking about it is the part:

"Raxxla also plays a role in several conspiracy theories, most of which attest that it has already been discovered by some kind of sinister cabal (or sole tyrant), which has leveraged its power to establish covert dominance over humanity."

To me this directly alludes to INRA story and Salvation aka (ahem) the Witch, and Azimuth Biotech (which was literally a shadowy cabal and a sole tyrant. But we didn't get Raxxla out of that yet.

Funnily enough, the only mention in The Dark Wheel codex entry is that the group is often mentioned together with "Raxxla".

The Dark Wheel codex in fact seems to have a basic hint on what is going on: that the group gives people secretly a test, and only if you pass the test, you get inducted into the actual Dark Wheel - which perhaps gives people actual access to Raxxla (rather than the accidental run-in that perhaps Drakkster had) - but that isn't actually stated in the codex. The Pareco tip-off stuff would be the closest thing I've seen to that.

 

[SHEA PARDH]

Btw, I've been playing around a bit with scanning systems without FSS, partly for fun, partly to just see how the OG way worked. Obviously, if the system has already been scanned, this isn't a big deal because you just a bunch of "unexplored" points you fly over to. But if you hit a brand new system that hasn't been touched, it's a whole different ballgame.

That makes me wonder if perhaps Drakkster triggered something this way. Let's say this whole encounter depends on actually autoscanning some value or number of bodies? Which still in the bubble is trivial-ish. Say the Pareco stuff is the way to get the "trader" DW elite status, while the autoscan value is the "exploration" DW elite status somehow?

 

[Ch3x]

To me this directly alludes to INRA story and Salvation aka (ahem) the Witch, and Azimuth Biotech (which was literally a shadowy cabal and a sole tyrant. But we didn't get Raxxla out of that yet.

We did get HIP 22460 and idk if this has been said before but that has got to be the ompholas rift (the Proteus site). Salvation is in Raxxla or whatever he sent is. That's where I'd rest my chips right now; pre-colonization given the war ended and nothing has really changed.

 

[Reyedog]

So I'm going to try my

: Right Ascension Axis

: Acceleration Axis

: Double X Axis

: Longitudinal Axis

method around system's by and in AO Run.


The other set of system's I will try it at are all surrounding HIP 20948. From Merope and Pleiades if you go by a star to dim the skybox exposure and face and target that direction the stars form a spiral. Adjust it enough it looks like a necklace with a shiny jewel.

:image was taken by Pleiades Sector MN-T c3-15 facing it.

 

[SHEA PARDH]

We did get HIP 22460 and idk if this has been said before but that has got to be the ompholas rift (the Proteus site). Salvation is in Raxxla or whatever he sent is. That's where I'd rest my chips right now; pre-colonization given the war ended and nothing has really changed.

The part with Omphalos Rift there is very possible - they had to somehow build a pangalactic (and transdimensional) weapon and that doesn't just randomly happen. Also, if this wasn't a one-off, where did the tech go? So it'd make sense if it was based on something that humans didn't create and wasn't 20 of lying around.

 

[SHEA PARDH]

So I'm going to try my

: Right Ascension Axis

: Acceleration Axis

: Double X Axis

: Longitudinal Axis

method around system's by and in AO Run.


The other set of system's I will try it at are all surrounding HIP 20948. From Merope and Pleiades if you go by a star to dim the skybox exposure and face and target that direction the stars form a spiral. Adjust it enough it looks like a necklace with a shiny jewel.

:image was taken by Pleiades Sector MN-T c3-15 facing it.

Looking forward to seeing how that turns out.

 

[Reyedog]

Looking forward to seeing how that turns out.

Already got weird stuff happening. I wasn't able to take a snapshot of it but AIN 5 changed distances. Went from a 5,205ls to 15,805ls to 10,605ls from the main star. Now i havn't moved an inch from the star at all. I'm also in normal space. I wish I could catch it being closer.