The Star Citizen Thread v5

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Dante80

Dante80
Tuub t Tute said:
Umm no. Handling it properly would be a full and frank admission from the CEO that they screwed up. The fault lies with CiG and the tags existing in the first place. Not with Zendesk for un-hiding them!

Not sure if this is a lost in translation, your post appears to be veering towards blaming a software glitch for revealing something distasteful; rather than condemning the distasteful thing itself?
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Here is my view.

Tagging your customers (and having that tag change the CS staffs' approach against them) is a little naughty I think, and actually runs contrary to what any serious company wants their customers to feel about their CS processes.


The actual customer being able to view said tags though is straight up idiotic from a marketing/PR perspective.


That is a poor show from CIG imo. In the grand scheme of things, I don't think this issue is too important or serious (after all, CIG is not the only company doing this, I presume) but still...poor show. It is not too flattering for someone that has put thousands of dollars into supporting a game..having the game support tag him as a special snowflake or high maintenance..
 

Deedrix

Deedrix
Dante80 said:
Here is my view.

Tagging your customers (and having that tag change the CS staffs' approach against them) is a little naughty I think, and actually runs contrary to what any serious company wants their customers to feel about their CS processes.


The actual customer being able to view said tags though is straight up idiotic from a marketing/PR perspective.


That is a poor show from CIG imo. In the grand scheme of things, I don't think this issue is too important or serious (after all, CIG is not the only company doing this, I presume) but still...poor show. It is not too flattering for someone that has put thousands of dollars into supporting a game..having the game support tag him as a special snowflake or high maintenance..
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"I don't think this issue is too important or serious"
Problem is that in reality it is important. They prioritize their CS tickets based on your requests and interactions on other websites. So not only are they monitoring what you say on their forums but others as well. They use this information to put you under a category or "Org". This is a horrible business practice. If you're not quick easy money for them they slap a demeaning label on you and get to you in their down time.

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Knightshark said:
So, what does snowflake mean in this context anyway?
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“snowflake”, a term used by Sandi in an email as a derogatory term for people she feels are entitled and unnecessarily demanding.
 
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milligna

milligna
Knightshark said:
So, what does snowflake mean in this context anyway?
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Someone who thinks they are unique and require extra attention, presumably. Derived from " no two snowflakes are alike."

Here's an example of it being used in a sentence by the head of CIG CS.

"When I have seen this year is a vocal minority of people who get butt-hurt that they are not a special snowflake anymore and butt hurt their opinion isn't well received so they shout louder or find someone who agrees with them to try to validate their opinion."

Its attitudes like this that really show how refreshing CIG is in treating the people who literally gave them piles of free money with zero strings attached. Charming stuff.

This is also why professionals are usually employed in these roles.
 
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Cunch Biffhard

C
Dante80 said:
Here is my view.

In the grand scheme of things, I don't think this issue is too important or serious (after all, CIG is not the only company doing this, I presume) but still...poor show.
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It depends, on the face of it they are breaking the law. The Snowflakes and High Maintenance thing is stupidly unprofessional, but irrelevant when you consider that they are tracking who is a member of an unrelated community, what people are called on Youtube and so on. They are not permitted to do that.
Would you consider CIG flagrantly breaking the law serious? I would.
 
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Zyll Goliat

Zyll Goliat
Dante80 said:
Here is my view.

Tagging your customers (and having that tag change the CS staffs' approach against them) is a little naughty I think, and actually runs contrary to what any serious company wants their customers to feel about their CS processes.


The actual customer being able to view said tags though is straight up idiotic from a marketing/PR perspective.


That is a poor show from CIG imo. In the grand scheme of things, I don't think this issue is too important or serious (after all, CIG is not the only company doing this, I presume) but still...poor show. It is not too flattering for someone that has put thousands of dollars into supporting a game..having the game support tag him as a special snowflake or high maintenance..
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This is open CUSTOMER DISCRIMINATION and should be prohibited by the law,CIG is doing monkey business again&again and this Circus must be stopped.I don't care if anyone going to sue them or not but the Gaming media should wrote about this immediately because if not this clown and his circus threat to destroy not only any future space sim KS games but many other independent backed projects out there...
 
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Backer42

B
Dante80 said:
I am happy that CIG is addressing this issue properly. Customers should not have been able to see those tags.
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Actually under UK data protection law customers are entitled to see all stored data about them. Also they seem to have used the CS database to store info, which their own intelligence service collected (like marking them as "Goons"). That by itself is a criminal offense in most contries (because as commercial operation you are only allowed to use info which the customer submitted himself).
 

LastCaress

L
milligna said:
Car and flight sims where it's easier to bolt on and makes sense: PCars, Assetto Corsa, iRacing, LFS, DCS, War Thunder. It's taken them all a few years from the point of initial support to get the menus and UI working correctly, tho. But they are all doing it and realize how VR from here on in is almost required in sims. We'll have more resolution soon enough, but when you've got a HOTAS or a wheel setup... man, it's tough going back from that presence, immersion, and headtracking.

Also simple tabletop stuff like Blazerush and Legend of Dungeon.

Something with an FPS component? Not so much. You have things like Alien: Isolation or Dying Light that planned on VR, then realized they couldn't make it a GOOD experience so just dropped it and left it as an undocumented mode and gave up on VR officially added later. Valve attempted experiments with HL2 and TF2 but even they couldn't make it work to their satisfaction and quietly dropped it too. And that's VALVE. They had a huge interest in making it work. Carmack threw a big chunk of his brain at Minecraft for a year and a half, and all the press on it still mentions people being sick. The Gear VR version he suggests you use with a swivel chair is out but the Rift version is still being tweaked, no doubt due to all those articles mentioning ginger treats and sim sickness.

Nothing done on CryEngine 3 that I can think of.

It's relatively easy to just switch things to 3D rendering and make the camera work for VR. Much harder is all the UI, animation changes, reworking the menus, removing all the graphical tricks engines use to cut corners that don't work in 3D, problems of world scale that work in 2d but look utterly wrong in VR, and solving sim sickness issues with locomotion.

CIG has done ZERO of that. They don't have anybody working on it and haven't planned for VR support considering the implementation of the UI and those awful animations.

That doesn't sound like they can deliver VR support to SC and S42 as planned. If Valve can't solve FPS locomotion, the crobber baron sure isn't going to. He should just TELL US. Not once have we had honest talk on the subject. Just promises, dancing around the rude reality of it. They aren't being honest with us... what else is new.

The only VR support these tech demos will ever have is via VorpX for the iron-stomached.
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Thanks for the useful explanation :)
 

Voivod

Voivod
CIG yet again, proving that by going the crowdfunded route, they are moving away from all those nasty publisher practices.

They are labeling you as a Special Snowflake so as to better protect you against those nasty publishers.

Duh.
 

hairychris

hairychris
Backer42 said:
Actually under UK data protection law customers are entitled to see all stored data about them.
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The customer will need to apply to the company's data commissionaire, and the company are allowed to charge a fee for time taken to process. This should be a policy somewhere that customers can read, and the company will need someone in that role if they are to fulfil UK data laws.

Backer42 said:
Also they seem to have used the CS database to store info, which their own intelligence service collected (like marking them as "Goons"). That by itself is a criminal offense in most contries (because as commercial operation you are only allowed to use info which the customer submitted himself).
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Definitely dicey ground, but without a lawyer looking at it I can't say anything.

Note: I've had headaches involving data privacy laws as part of my job. Things get really (not) fun when multiple jurisdictions and stuff like financial or personal information are involved.

As for the actual drop-downs: really, really stupid. A combination of awful website coding and awful corporate culture. The first thing you shouldn't expect from a software company, and the second thing you should really not put down in writing even if you think those things privately. Absolute amateur hour stuff, completely unprofessional.
 

Knightshark

Knightshark
So how are they getting the info about offsite activity? To they pay people to track their backers nicknames? Is this automated?
 

Knightshark

Knightshark
So the backers pay for their own surveillance so to speak.
Or is this covered by the subscription stuff?
 
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Asp Explorer

Asp Explorer
Oh the alphabet soup just gets delicious from here.

There's PI, PII, NPI, SPI, PHI and PCI

SC have access to all these except PHI - and they have to handle them all according to very specific and strict regulations. If there is any evidence they are using PI or PII or anything else otherwise than in accordance - bad things can happen.
 
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