What Constitutes as Cheating

And how Inara gets its data? By us, PC players, that use a 3rd party addon...
Actually, Inara and other sites like it, get the data from the Frontier API (Application Programming Interface) for which both consoles and PC's can generate data.

API: a set of functions and procedures allowing the creation of applications that access the features or data of an operating system, application, or other service.


o7...
 
And how Inara gets its data? By us, PC players, that use a 3rd party addon...

Not something that effects gameplay. Merely allows a site to pull infomation off off your PC, it has ZERO effect on your gameplay other than giving you a location to look stuff up should it be needed.

By all rights, something that effects gameplay that is a TP addon is indeed, in reality cheating.
 
If I bash the powerplant of a conda to bellow 0% and it still flies, boosts and fires back at me, then the NPC is cheating.
When an NPC drops from hyperspace and immediately tries to interdict me, then he is cheating.
When I boost, FA-OFF and turn 180º and boost again, I'm cheating, cause no pilot could survive that G shock in a ship that reaches max speed >500m/s. (around 37 gs)
When you use synthesis to create more stuff, you're cheating, because materials occupy no space in-game, and so allow you to have more ammo/heatsinks/chaffs etc.. by science-magic.
Even today's everyday people can withstand horizontal g-force of 20g for less than 10s and peak g-force of 214g. I imagine that our remlok suits and genetic modifications can help us withstand g-force without problems in the 34th century.
 
Even today's everyday people can withstand horizontal g-force of 20g for less than 10s and peak g-force of 214g. I imagine that our remlok suits and genetic modifications can help us withstand g-force without problems in the 34th century.
100 push-ups, 100 sit-ups, 100 squats, and a 10k run. EVERY SINGLE DAY!
 
Not something that effects gameplay. Merely allows a site to pull infomation off off your PC, it has ZERO effect on your gameplay other than giving you a location to look stuff up should it be needed.

By all rights, something that effects gameplay that is a TP addon is indeed, in reality cheating.
Of course it affects gameplay on almost all levels. People using external websites have the upper hand.
 
Attack Chimp walks up hill both ways in the snow to anywhere he is trying to get to. Grows his own food in the backyard with nothing but a pointy stick to plow with relying on the wind to plant seed and rain to water.

Also, turning on the game is cheating. You have an advantage over those who don't turn on the game.
 
Beware cheaters! Your bots will turn on you and join up with a self aware constellation of communications satellites. Next thing you know a T100 will be stalking you and it'll be judgement day.
 
I guess Twitch streamsniping is just a poor man's matchmaker at that point too. Except when the ganked ask for support to refund for free and report the gankers for harassment. That would be cheating.
 
I'd definitely consider that cheating, and it's likely that Frontier would as well.

Sensitivity slopes, pip macros, or using something like voice attack to implement simple commands are one thing.

Automating complex or extended interactions is quite another.
And that kinda begets my point... context and intent matters immensely. That keyboard macro was functionally no different to something like voice attack. Market UI allowed the selection of selling biowaste with just a series of timed keystrokes. The key macro was literally just:
  • Enter key (select biowaste for sale)
  • "Left" key (to decrement the counter, i.e "sell 1 biowaste"
  • Enter (to confirm sale)
  • Wait 10 seconds
...copy and paste 250 times. I justify that usage at the time because I was intending to prove a (now patched) exploit and report it to FD, but clearly any other use would've definitely been cheating. Of course, philosophical arguments then came up of "Well, now I know that, if I choose to sell 10t of every type of mineral for profit, instead of 200t of gold, because I know the former will have a bigger effect on influence, is that cheating?"... but I digress.

Bottom line as far as I'm concerned is it really doesn't matter what player's consider cheating... it's FD's prerogative. 12.4 of the EULA is a key part of this.

12.4 If we fail to insist that you perform any of your obligations under this EULA, or if we do not enforce our rights against you, or if we delay in doing so, that will not mean that we have waived our rights against you and will not mean that you do not have to comply with those obligations.
What this means is that... assume Voice Attack is at least in breach of something in the EULA and would otherwise be considered "cheating"... just because FD don't say "it's cheating" doesn't mean it isn't cheating. EULAs aren't legally binding either, as they're generally full of holes, contraditions and vague speech. And that's fine; the intent is for (in this case, FD) to have the flexibility to, in all circumstances, to say "Play nice, or we take your toys away".

A lot of people are throwing up their definitions of cheating, and people are following up with "What about Voice Attack? What about things which auto-upload to EDSM?"... if you look at the EULA, these are all in breach of some aspects of it. Even the ubiquitous "modifying the colour palette" isn't explicitly allowed, and actually falls afoul of some of the EULA assertions (usually 3c, which is so vague it's not funny)

So is FD going to go out and claim that these are all in breach of the EULA (which is what 'cheating' is)? Of course not... FD know these enrich and value-add to the game... but doing nothing doesn't mean they're "OK" in the context of the EULA.

... tl;dr people claiming "Is Voice Attack/Keyboard Macros/Colour Pallette switches/EDSM auto-uploaders cheating?"... maybe it's not cheating, but it's almost certainly in breach of (someone's interpretation of) the EULA, just FD don't care (on a case-by-case basis)
 
And that kinda begets my point... context and intent matters immensely. That keyboard macro was functionally no different to something like voice attack. Market UI allowed the selection of selling biowaste with just a series of timed keystrokes. The key macro was literally just:
  • Enter key (select biowaste for sale)
  • "Left" key (to decrement the counter, i.e "sell 1 biowaste"
  • Enter (to confirm sale)
  • Wait 10 seconds
...copy and paste 250 times. I justify that usage at the time because I was intending to prove a (now patched) exploit and report it to FD, but clearly any other use would've definitely been cheating. Of course, philosophical arguments then came up of "Well, now I know that, if I choose to sell 10t of every type of mineral for profit, instead of 200t of gold, because I know the former will have a bigger effect on influence, is that cheating?"... but I digress.

Bottom line as far as I'm concerned is it really doesn't matter what player's consider cheating... it's FD's prerogative. 12.4 of the EULA is a key part of this.



What this means is that... assume Voice Attack is at least in breach of something in the EULA and would otherwise be considered "cheating"... just because FD don't say "it's cheating" doesn't mean it isn't cheating. EULAs aren't legally binding either, as they're generally full of holes, contraditions and vague speech. And that's fine; the intent is for (in this case, FD) to have the flexibility to, in all circumstances, to say "Play nice, or we take your toys away".

A lot of people are throwing up their definitions of cheating, and people are following up with "What about Voice Attack? What about things which auto-upload to EDSM?"... if you look at the EULA, these are all in breach of some aspects of it. Even the ubiquitous "modifying the colour palette" isn't explicitly allowed, and actually falls afoul of some of the EULA assertions (usually 3c, which is so vague it's not funny)

So is FD going to go out and claim that these are all in breach of the EULA (which is what 'cheating' is)? Of course not... FD know these enrich and value-add to the game... but doing nothing doesn't mean they're "OK" in the context of the EULA.

... tl;dr people claiming "Is Voice Attack/Keyboard Macros/Colour Pallette switches/EDSM auto-uploaders cheating?"... maybe it's not cheating, but it's almost certainly in breach of (someone's interpretation of) the EULA, just FD don't care (on a case-by-case basis)
I would say that you are legally correct. The EULA doesn't leave room for FD to decide on a case-by-case basis which automation and modification is in accordance with the EULA and which isn't (the usual "...unless expressly permited by Frontier" clause).

3. (b) allows only changes and modifications that are expressly permitted by the EULA.
 
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