The Planetary landing and planetside missions discussion Thread
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I don't think seamless entry is the way to go. They have an obvious spot for a load screen in atmospheric reentry effects, which solves a lot of this issue.
As for planetary landing in general, though interesting, it's far less important to me than ship entry. What I mean by that is shipboard combat and EVA, all done in zero gravity. We could salvage wrecks, board larger ships, do EVA repairs on our own crafts or secure various forms of more volatile cargo during an EVA.
Just WOW!
Unbelievable! this will literally give hope to the hopeless.
The Outerra engine looks great - though in that video everything is (obviously) Earth-like. I wonder what scope it has for modelling/generating more alien landscapes. I'd love to see more extreme worlds, huge impact craters, massive rift valleys, supervolcanos, dramatic plateaus etc.
To me, the Unlimited Detail Engine looks like an engine for modelling small-scale, very high detail scenes (typically originating from laser scans). While hugely impressive, it's probably at the other end of the scale to Elite - massive scale, but probably quite low detail.
To me, the Unlimited Detail Engine looks like an engine for modelling small-scale, very high detail scenes (typically originating from laser scans). While hugely impressive, it's probably at the other end of the scale to Elite - massive scale, but probably quite low detail.
Forgive me if I'm wrong, but isn't the Outerra stuff used to model existing environments using laser scanning and then render them back in real time? Could this or something similar even be used for procedurally created environments?
It is pretty impressive though isn't it!
Forgive me if I'm wrong, but isn't the Outerra stuff used to model existing environments using laser scanning and then render them back in real time? Could this or something similar even be used for procedurally created environments?
It is pretty impressive though isn't it!
I don't think so, the videos I've seen (and what I've read) have been modelling large scale scenes, even planets. I don't think anyone's laser scanned Earth yet (that I know of!)
The Unlimited Detail Engine (from Euclidion, also linked above) seems to be more about modelling & rendering from laser scans. On the Outerra Wiki page, I found this (emphasis mine). Sounds interesting, what I thought we might see in ED given how massive the galaxy is and how difficult it is for one company to populate it with interesting content:
At first, I'd like FD to view each playable ships as though it was in FTL. Compartments, equipment tat can be interacted with for a performance bonus and a damage model.
Then - install the first person module, so you can get up and explore your own ship. Purely as a performance experiment at first, but then add crew stations and consequently, crew you can hire or obtain in the field somehow. They really don't need a sophisticated AI initially - just some sort of skill rating that would enhance module performance. Perhaps even permit active/passive abilities. It's been done before. repeatedly and there's absolutely no need to reinvent the wheel.
Now planetary/station landings would only make sense after things were sorted onboard. Even then, given procedurally-generated stellar bodies can yield interesting results - look at Minecraft seed mechanics. You can discover very interesting terrain features, even though the variety of terrain blocks is fairly limited.
What FD needs to avoid with planets is the mistake they did with the rest of the giant galaxy - an utter lack of value beyond... what? titular first discovery?
Planetary landings should be about surveys, mining, setting up installations and yes, safaris too. Otherwise what? You enter atmosphere, observe the terrain level of detail change from pixel to peninsula to plantlife and... do what? a DLC that only involves a nice view? No thanks.
Then - install the first person module, so you can get up and explore your own ship. Purely as a performance experiment at first, but then add crew stations and consequently, crew you can hire or obtain in the field somehow. They really don't need a sophisticated AI initially - just some sort of skill rating that would enhance module performance. Perhaps even permit active/passive abilities. It's been done before. repeatedly and there's absolutely no need to reinvent the wheel.
Now planetary/station landings would only make sense after things were sorted onboard. Even then, given procedurally-generated stellar bodies can yield interesting results - look at Minecraft seed mechanics. You can discover very interesting terrain features, even though the variety of terrain blocks is fairly limited.
What FD needs to avoid with planets is the mistake they did with the rest of the giant galaxy - an utter lack of value beyond... what? titular first discovery?
Planetary landings should be about surveys, mining, setting up installations and yes, safaris too. Otherwise what? You enter atmosphere, observe the terrain level of detail change from pixel to peninsula to plantlife and... do what? a DLC that only involves a nice view? No thanks.
I agree Panzer, but also needs actual fps action (fighting pirates on the planet & or assassination missions for the more evil among us) as well as EVA combat & ship boarding. If they do these things they won't have any money problems as there player base will become astronomical. I really hope to hear something about this soon.
Shadowma
Shadowma
Careful. Frontier is excellent making spaceship game. It didn't assure they will make good FPS game. Remember Eve Online and Dust ...
I don't understand why people think this instancing thing is gonna stop them doing a seamless landing. I assume when landing you will need to drop from SC. We do this already and we are in an instance that is solar system size. The planet therefore in terms of instance size is minuscule. I see no reason why (if they have achieved seamless landing) that you retain the same instance from space to planet.
I can't believe David Braben would be happy with a loading screen of any kind considering he has done all this before. And on a technological level it would be a bit of a cheat and a let down for everybody not to mention a massive damage to expectation.
I can't believe David Braben would be happy with a loading screen of any kind considering he has done all this before. And on a technological level it would be a bit of a cheat and a let down for everybody not to mention a massive damage to expectation.
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Indeed.
Look at how it is handled when approaching and dropping out in a ring system currently.
I suspect planetary landings will work in a similar fashion BUT since you will probably slow down even further in supercruise when closing in on a planet they will have time to start to stream in higher levels of models for the terrain and other objects much smoother unlike what happens with the rings. The main reason why the real 3D asteroids isn't loaded while in supercruise has nothing to do with SC in itself. It has everything to do with the speed you are moving at. This is why the 3D models of the rocks "pop into view" when exiting SC. If they would try to load these in while flying at 30 km per second they would go in and out of visible range so fast that any computer would go insane trying to load them in and out pretty much instantly and the framerate would tank completely. No matter what hardware you have.
When approaching a planet I suspect the minimum SC speed will go down even further. It pretty much has to since 30 km/s is waaaaaaaaay too fast when flying close to the ground. And in case anyone don't believe me...here you go:
[video=youtube;HqN3KNtQkBw]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HqN3KNtQkBw&feature=youtu.be[/video]
Now, since SC speeds obviously needs to be lowered further when closing in on a planet (as they already do BTW) so they go way below 30 km/s this also means that things won't be passing by so fast. Thus enabling things to load in a much smoother and seamless way. At any point during your approach you will be able to exit SC, but I also suspect that there will be a minimum altitude for using SC (just like with the rings) and when you get to close to the ground, let's say 20 km up, you will be forcibly dropped to normal space no matter what. From this point you will then travel the rest of the way using normal propulsion and since you are still 20 km up things like potential wildlife, vehicles or whatever else might be down there can fade into view just like in other open world games as you get closer. Same thing applies to seeing other players.
Short version.
Planetary landings is no different than closing in on a ring system in the game currently other than when we approach the planets the speed will go down further thus allowing things to appear smoother and more seamless.
Repped Tinman - that post perfectly describes Cobra's capabilities.
I wonder if the SC speed could be dropped for ring systems currently to say 10kms or so as you get near? The proximity code is obviously in there and it would allow people to see that part of current game in better detail/glory.
I wonder if the SC speed could be dropped for ring systems currently to say 10kms or so as you get near? The proximity code is obviously in there and it would allow people to see that part of current game in better detail/glory.
I guess it could (10 km/s would still probably be way to fast considering how densely the asteroids are packed), but I'm not sure it would look that great to be honest in it's current form. If you fly high up from a ring system you can quite clearly see the draw distance where the real 3D models end and the sprites begin in a circle around you ship. Sure, if they decided to create more intermediate step in the LOD system they could maybe get it to look good, but that is extra work and not really worth it in this case since there is no reason for flying above the ring that close in terms of gameplay without dropping out of SC.
An alternative solution would be to simply lower the density of the asteroids drastically and maybe make them bigger like the Inovae team has done.
[video=youtube;zR9KpK1Ua-Q]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zR9KpK1Ua-Q[/video]
This type of ring would actually probably be more realistic BUT the whole idea of dogfighting among the rocks would disappear since they would be placed so far apart from each other. Right now this environment is the only one in ED that has a "terrain" to take into account so removing this isn't ideal in terms of gameplay IMO.
I DO think there should be more variation to the rings in ED in terms of relative sizes of the asteroids and how densely they are packed. Shouldn't be to hard to play around with. Also things like asteroid bases or mining platforms close to RES sites as a sort of hub for the miners, but I've already gone off topic as it is...
Isn't supposed to be a big announcement at a game con of some sort in July? landings, please be a road map for development of landings!
Gamescom will be at the beginning of August.
Frontier have hinted they will reveal what "most" of the dev team have been working on in secret for PC & Mac.
Even if they have been working on planetary landings, it doesn't necessarily mean that's what they are referring to.
Hurricane Moon
Banned
it would be great to hear some small news,just a "its definatley coming" will do...
then i think a lot of us may stop banging on frontiers door about it,myself included.
the game will just open up completely into a proper sandbox space opera......Just walking out of the ship and going to some neon lit spaceport bar does it for me lol.
Sir braben wants it...a lot of us share his vision,as it stands the current game is not exactly a technilogical feat when you break it down(painted backdrops ect) so i think all the goodies we want will make it that AAA space Opera.
where we actually can blaze our own proper immersive trail.
peace commanders
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As I've said before, unless we (finally) get some news about core gameplay/mechanic improvements, I think I'll give up all hope TBH - https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=161431
ps: Sorry for off topic! Lost track of which thread was which!
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What if we could fly into gas giants?
Yes, let's hope they have thought about that!
(3:55 in the video)
[video=youtube;iTBvpd3_Vqk]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iTBvpd3_Vqk[/video]
(That was back in 2012...so that prototype isn't necessarily as "early days" now as he described it then...I would love to see the current version!)
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