Modes Mode Feature Exclusivity...AKA..."Render unto Caesar..."

FudePoof

FudePoof
Sylveria said:


So..."Render unto Caesar..."

Since Mode Feature Exclusivity is being justified by Sandro's statement of Player versus Player style in Open, the next best course of action would be then to remove all PvE activity from Open and make it available only to Private Groups and Solo as a result, as well as make Player vs Player activity completely impossible in Private Groups. This would dramatically increase the chances of players who find PvE content more to their taste and participation in these modes as a result would also increase. Since you're establishing a clear separation of such features from modes associated with direct activity, this can be the only eventual logical result.

"For every action, there's an equal and opposite reaction..."
- Newton's Third Law of Physics​

PvP <=Mode Feature Exclusivity=> PVE

Or

Open <=Mode Feature Exclusivity=>Private Groups & Solo

I finally see Sandro's logic here, it's a truly brilliant plan. [yesnod]

Damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead!
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Truly a new tier of idiocy from the pve crowd.

Moving pp to open is an equal and opposite reaction to crime and punishment receiving the carebear rainbow tattoo.

The pve crowd got their nerf to griefing, it's about time open got its buff for real pvp.

You can't have everything your way. A humble lesson that the pvp crowd was beaten over the head with ever since release.
There hasn't been a buff to piracy, combat, or pvp bounty rewards; meanwhile the game cranks out whole new incentives to not kill players.

If PP gets switched to open it is the bed the loud and tyranical pve goofs made.

Fdev, please make pvp great again.

Afterall, PP is molded by players.
-Players?
Vs?
Players?


Ohhh, that's right. That makes it pvp! It belongs in open. A place where players experience the galaxy fdev made, including the pve one, with each other.
 
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Hooplah

Hooplah
Greetings,

Lots of threads have been started promoting Open only Power Play because they feel that it is unbalanced with haulers playing in Solo that they cannot kill. But who is addressing the unfair balance swinging the other way with haulers going against engineered combat ships often in wings? This can make hauling in Power Play very difficult if not impossible for the ENTIRE Eilte Dangerous player base across multiple platforms. Private groups also get together and compete in Power Play without having greifers interrupting. New and current Power Players going for advanced weapons and modules will have to deal with previous experienced combat players that already have them.

Many after a few expensive rebuys will just give up on Power Play and eventually it will end up as a pew-pew only event. Except for those already having the skills and desire to go into harm's way haulers still won't be in Open so nothing is really resolved. That plus depriving content in the other modes the customers have paid for.

There is no simple solution. Still there must be a BGS solution out there that would balance this out and still provide player content for all modes. It needs to be considered less hauling in Open only Power Play for many ends up looking like this...

Regards


076999.jpg
 
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Perseus

Perseus
Jockey79 said:
It was never great to start with, as PvP is *OPTIONAL* in Elite.
So stealing content from the rest of the game to justify pushing the small, ignorable part of the game is ridiculous.
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How do you know it wasn't great? How do you know those who desire the change are small?
You can ignore PvP no problem but if the proposals go through, PvP has a context at last in PP. Don't worry though, it'll be *optional*. Nothing much to get a fuss up really. Out of interest, how much PP were you doing in the past?
Devs have proposed it, Jockey, maybe the writing is on the wall - maybe it always was.
You're right about the stealing though - absolute theft of 'open' content by allowing solo/PG mode to affect PP. I'm so glad it's been acknowledged by the devs and I'm hoping they have the minerals to go through with it.
 

Jockey79

Jockey79
Phisto Sobanii said:
Jockey,

How much did you give a rip about PowerPlay until it possibly going Open Only threatened your precious ‘All Modes Are Equal’ act?
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On and off, when I want to get modules or am not focused on something else (fall back option when bored with everything else).

Perseus said:
How do you know it wasn't great? How do you know those who desire the change are small?
You can ignore PvP no problem but if the proposals go through, PvP has a context at last in PP. Don't worry though, it'll be *optional*. Nothing much to get a fuss up really. Out of interest, how much PP were you doing in the past?
Devs have proposed it, Jockey, maybe the writing is on the wall - maybe it always was.
You're right about the stealing though - absolute theft of 'open' content by allowing solo/PG mode to affect PP. I'm so glad it's been acknowledged by the devs and I'm hoping they have the minerals to go through with it.
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How do I know it wasn't great you ask, I'll tell you - your lot aint shut up complaining about it since day one.

As for my small comment, I didn't say the people were - "to justify pushing the small, ignorable part of the game is ridiculous."
Next time wear your glasses when reading my comments ;)

Devs propose lots of things, here try reading these and see just how much they say actually happens; https://forums.frontier.co.uk/forumdisplay.php/109-Archived-Discussion-Forums
In fact, PP Open rewards was talked about before - that didn't happen.
So until it is in game, I'd hold fire on the celebrations.

And the only stealing going on here is by trolls and griefers, as all content is supposed to be available in all modes.
As DBOBE said, he wants people to do what makes them excited - this is a big slap in the face for loyal customers who are not excited about being forced into open mode.
 

Jockey79

Jockey79
CMDR M. Lehman said:
Then I'm sure that you'll agree with me that it's nonsense that I can't PvP or multicrew in solo.
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But you can PvP in Solo, didn't you hear?

Turns out doing faction work or Power play in Solo is PvP....

tenor.gif

0...-david-braben



Which is why you have to be forced into open.
Because your PvP in Solo is stronger than their PvP Open, as they cannot possibly do what you do in order to counter it.
 

Jockey79

Jockey79
CMDR M. Lehman said:
Careful there. You're dangerously close to seeing things from the perspective of those who have actually delved into Powerplay.
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lol, the best bit is - this lot seem to think I don't play it, when in fact I do (when it suits me).

It's the same in every mixed mode game, if you don't do it their way - then you're accused of not knowing/playing etc...
Even when I've explained PP several times, in plain child like English. They just cannot accept people know the truth.
 

CMDR M. Lehman

CMDR M. Lehman
Jockey79 said:
lol, the best bit is - this lot seem to think I don't play it, when in fact I do (when it suits me).

It's the same in every mixed mode game, if you don't do it their way - then you're accused of not knowing/playing etc...
Even when I've explained PP several times, in plain child like English. They just cannot accept people know the truth.
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I have the awful suspicion that for as much as you "played" PP (module shopping, from the way I'm reading it) you've never experienced the sinking feeling of realizing that your power has been undermined or 5C'd from solo and PG. For you it's a simple issue of mode sameness- a ridiculous concept if there ever was one.

Most curious that the majority of those who *have* felt that feeling are in favor of open-only, isn't it?
 
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Agony_Aunt

Agony_Aunt
Perseus said:
How do you know it wasn't great?
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Posts on forums for the last 3+ years.

There was a time, long before PP, around 1.0, where PvP wasn't too bad. Not many people had big ships, there was no engineering, no HRPs/MRPs/SCBs/etc, and things were a lot more balanced in terms of PvP. There was a time when the Viper Mk3 was considered king of PvP... imagine that!

But the more FD added, the worse it got, the wider the gap between a combat ships and a hauling ship, and the quicker a gankmobile could take down a non-combat ship.
 

Jockey79

Jockey79
CMDR M. Lehman said:
I have the awful suspicion that for as much as you "played" PP (module shopping, from the way I'm reading it) you've never experienced the sinking feeling of realizing that your power has been undermined or 5C'd from solo and PG. For you it's a simple issue of mode sameness- a ridiculous concept if there ever was one.

Most curious that the majority of those who *have* felt that feeling are in favor of open-only, isn't it?
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Oh I've had that "sinking feeling" - which is why I now treat it as somewhere to get parts if/when I want them.

PP does need fixing, I've said that for a long time. But locking it to a mode wont fix it.
Heck, even I gave some suggestions to fix it in the PP forums. But too many people suffer with "tunnel vision" atm and actually believe locking it will fix it.

It won't solve 5C in any way, shape or form. Some of the 5C folks have been even bragging about it - but some folks just refuse to see it.
 

Perseus

Perseus
How do I know it wasn't great you ask, I'll tell you - your lot aint shut up complaining about it since day one.
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Which "lot" is that? Also, is this "lot" a lot?

As for my small comment, I didn't say the people were - "to justify pushing the small, ignorable part of the game is ridiculous."
Next time wear your glasses when reading my comments ;)
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Thank you for the advice and, more pertinently, your clarification. So you mean the actual gameplay element as opposed to that elements participants (who do, after all, drive the mechanic). You use the words 'small' and 'ignorable' - I wonder why you're so concerned about the proposed changes then? If PP is, as you say, small and ignorable then why the furious resistance? It seems contradictory, does it not? Are concerns about potential bothering you?


Devs propose lots of things, here try reading these and see just how much they say actually happens; https://forums.frontier.co.uk/forumdisplay.php/109-Archived-Discussion-Forums
In fact, PP Open rewards was talked about before - that didn't happen.
So until it is in game, I'd hold fire on the celebrations.
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They do indeed, I remember well. I'm not celebrating as of yet, although I am pleased that the proposals have been refined and are seeing the light of day again.

And the only stealing going on here is by trolls and griefers, as all content is supposed to be available in all modes.
As DBOBE said, he wants people to do what makes them excited - this is a big slap in the face for loyal customers who are not excited about being forced into open mode.
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I don't know what you mean by trolls and griefers, I'm afraid. It's in the same lexicon garbage heap as 'pew-pew' and 'carebear' under the focus of my reading glasses.
Excited is subjective and I'm sure you'd celebrate diversity in the game.
I can't understand how you determine it as a face slap when:
PP is small and ignorable (your words)
Nobody is forcing anybody to do PP
Development has always been on the cards for the game.
 
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