Automation and Scripting - An investigation into further abuses of BGS and Powerplay

Stigbob · Mar 17, 2018

jonesskill said:
This is sad, if you people already give up this discussion.

How you think another companies handle to detect/ban bots? WOW and Lineage for exemple widouth player reports they will never be able to discover all the bots.
While people can still play alone, they will ever get a way to use bots widouth get detected.

If bots exists, widouth player reports will be nearly impossible to FDEV detect it.

I haven't given up on the discussion, I've disagreed with the objection to modes since I first read about them in 2014 before I bought the game. The fact that players have the choice of modes was fundamental to me buying in, I wouldn't have bothered otherwise. I think the modes are an inspired idea.

I'm just sick of hearing people who didn't read about the game before buying it complain that one of it's core features exists.

Botting is bad, modes are irrelevant to that.

Stigbob · Mar 17, 2018

CMDR Tom D said:
Right now, I don't.

This post is meant to generate awareness that this is a real thing and give people the tools to detect and counter it.

Should it prove to be a widespread issue like we suspect, the collective upset from players will do the rest.

The problem there is FDEV have set the bar very low on punishing cheating, just look at the 5-1 exploit they didn't even reset the saves. It would be hard for them to suddenly get all militant with cheats without looking like they were picking unfairly on just one group of cheats to look like they were dealing with it.

Having said that they've always been harsh on hacking, so they may deal with this issue more robustly.

Pew · Mar 17, 2018

Fer the record, although we may speak in the same manner, verminstar and I are not the same person. I do love yer accent mate, ye remind me o home.

IamNickMan · Mar 17, 2018

CMDR Tom D said:
Right now, I don't.

This post is meant to generate awareness that this is a real thing and give people the tools to detect and counter it.

Should it prove to be a widespread issue like we suspect, the collective upset from players will do the rest.

ED has always been a tight, and for the most part mature community. I hope for the same... And maybe some perma bans

Mohrgan · Mar 17, 2018

Everything is going fine until... 'Ultimatum to FDev'. Then all credibility is lost. Spicy Bois, anyone.

CMDR Tom D · Mar 17, 2018

Mohrgan said:
Everything is going fine until... 'Ultimatum to FDev'. Then all credibility is lost. Spicy Bois, anyone.

How would you change it?

Brrokk · Mar 17, 2018

Mohrgan said:
Everything is going fine until... 'Ultimatum to FDev'. Then all credibility is lost. Spicy Bois, anyone.

I thought that was an unfortunate change of tone too. Agreed that bots are bad for the game though.

NeilF · Mar 17, 2018

As already asked... Why use bots in OPEN? Surely it would be a bonkers choice? Why not in SOLO?

ps: Well done on some pretty damning video evidence there!

Stigbob · Mar 17, 2018

CMDR Tom D said:
How would you change it?

If you don't mind I'll have a bash at that :

Original :

CMDR Tom D said:
Ultimatum to FDev

FDev, This is hugely frustrating for the player base, we’ve demonstrated that the issue is widespread and now we’ve raised awareness I'm certain you’re going to see more stories like this one pop up.

What we want to see are better tools in game for detecting this kind of play.

Better investigative tools for FDev and more robust action taken on perpetrators of automated accounts

Better observational tools for players to detect others that may not be flying in open, that includes better station services that outline other docked players movements and actions

STOP SELLING THE GAME FOR £5! This is fueling the epidemic! You sell the game regularly at that price it makes it easy for these people to buy Powerplay and BGS ready accounts. All the Bot users need to do is program in a money making route and they can influence the BGS to no end.

Your game is one of a kind and it's disgraceful that people abuse it. This needs fixing ASAP.

Suggested rewrite :

Request to FDEV

This is hugely frustrating for the playerbase, we've demonstrated that this issue has effected our faction more than once and may be more widespread.

I would suggest this matter is looked into and that robust action is taken against players found to be carrying out this form of cheating.

I have submitted the information already at your request, please feel free to contact me if I can assist you any further.

Chaparral · Mar 17, 2018

+1 OP.

Botting is the bane of MMOs. If anyone thinks manipulating the BGS would be the limit of such behavior, you have a lot to learn about the foul nature of people that use bots.

I've seen a ton of whining about the evils of gold rushes. This demonstrates that scripted bots can efficiently manage trade loops. It won't be long before gold farming scripts will be available to players at large. Inter-player trade won't be needed for gold-selling to become a thing. Buy a rank grinding bot, a trading bot, a material grinding bot, etc. etc.

I like the modes, but if this is prevalent, it provides compelling evidence to sever them with respect to the BGS.

Stigbob · Mar 17, 2018

Commander Danicus said:
+1 OP.

Botting is the bane of MMOs. If anyone thinks manipulating the BGS would be the limit of such behavior, you have a lot to learn about the foul nature of people that use bots.

I've seen a ton of whining about the evils of gold rushes. This demonstrates that scripted bots can efficiently manage trade loops. It won't be long before gold farming scripts will be available to players at large. Inter-player trade won't be needed for gold-selling to become a thing. Buy a rank grinding bot, a trading bot, a material grinding bot, etc. etc.

I like the modes, but if this is prevalent, it provides compelling evidence to sever them with respect to the BGS.

No it doesn't, the modes are irrelevant to this.

CMDR_Brantford of FLC · Mar 17, 2018

Felicia Winters and indeed every PP power has trouble with 5C ("fifth column) on Powerplay. We've gone looking for these people as well and have never found them. We suspect either they are players playing/hiding in solo or private group.. or they are also Bots. Tau-1 Hydra is Winters 5C System. It routinely gets 30-50K every week. Aisling Duval's 5C is worse.. her players had to throw over 200K of preparation at a system to stop the 5C from prepping a bad one for her last week.

CMDR Tom D · Mar 17, 2018

Stigbob said:
If you don't mind I'll have a bash at that :

I guess my question is more, whats wrong with better controls in game for FDev and players to detect these bots and pacify them?

lokvette · Mar 17, 2018

Botting is cheating, fdev its time to put down the nerf bat and bring out the ban hammer.

NeilF · Mar 17, 2018

CMDR Tom D said:
I guess my question is more, whats wrong with better controls in game for FDev and players to detect these bots and pacify them?

Because, we can all just run these scripts to trade 24/7 in SOLO?

AbsinthSvK · Mar 17, 2018

Lol. And you even dont know what people do in solo, you never see them or report them. Another reason to ignore whole powerplay thing.

IamNickMan · Mar 17, 2018

CMDR_Brantford said:
Felicia Winters and indeed every PP power has trouble with 5C ("fifth column) on Powerplay. We've gone looking for these people as well and have never found them. We suspect either they are players playing/hiding in solo or private group.. or they are also Bots. Tau-1 Hydra is Winters 5C System. It routinely gets 30-50K every week. Aisling Duval's 5C is worse.. her players had to throw over 200K of preparation at a system to stop the 5C from prepping a bad one for her last week.

I've watch some of these events wondering myself whether this was the case. It was normal for Soholia to occasionally pick up 8-15 but after awhile started picking up 50-75k every week for MONTHS.

lokvette said:
Botting is cheating, fdev its time to put down the nerf bat and bring out the ban hammer.

I like your choice of words

Stigbob · Mar 17, 2018

CMDR Tom D said:
I guess my question is more, whats wrong with better controls in game for FDev and players to detect these bots and pacify them?

The problem isn't what you ask it's how you ask it :

Drop the word ultimatum completely no one reacts well to demands.
Drop the thinly veiled threat (more stories like this) no-one reacts well to threats.
Drop the request for better observational tools in game, they are always abused by creepy stalker types.
Drop telling them how much to sell their game for, you sound miffed it cost you more.

The last section damages your efforts, be nice when you want something.

CMDR Tom D · Mar 17, 2018

NeilF said:
Because, we can all just run these scripts to trade 24/7 in SOLO?

And being able to detect their behavior and actions in Solo would help us figure out whos doing what, not only so we can fight them in game but report them as such.

FDev knows we want action we told them so in the reports we made, if they're not going to fix it themselves give us the tools to fix it for them.

GG7 · Mar 17, 2018

jonesskill said:
Really OP?

People will lose time creating a BOT to manipulate a system like BGS? Or even powerplay?
I don't see the reason to spend time joing this causes, imagine working in a BOT and letting your computer ONLINE and wasting energy to make this (Makes no sense, really)

BGS means nothing, just minor faction names in systems, powerplay means even less... If people really earn something to make this but i don't see the point, sorry;

Woosh!

That is the sound of this serious issue's ramifications for everyone who plays the game flying right over this guy's head! ^^ [rolleyes]

Oh well... Last time I checked, being terminally clueless is not a crime.