People extrapolate people's behavior based on observed behavior. It sucks to exist on the same planet with people you strongly suspect believe things that are mutually exclusive to what you believe. Occasionally you bump into these people and the more sensitive you are the more it hurts. I suspect a strong correlation between sensitivity and pigeonholing.
Combat logging no longer an exploit? * trigger warning *
- Thread starter bladebss
- Start date
It means you're on the ignore list.
No, no, no, no, no.
You're talking about menu logging which gives the 15 second timer. Menu logging is entirely legal and allowed. What we're talking about is combat logging, where you either pull your network cable, or kill the Elite process so you disappear instantly. The two are completely different things
Nothing ever happened when I hit alt-F4 to rage quit the game.
The combat logger is the griefer though...I agree with several of the summaries above.
I agree that clogging is an exploit. I'll never do it. But if anyone did it to me I'd be very pleased and chalk it up as a triumph.
I also don't mind at all that it's possible; I enjoy the fact that it annoys griefers.
I suspect that this almost-dissonance and the associated annoyance are the reasons it keeps coming up for discussion in the forum.
although one does have to add that ones bottom is rather sore, what what
I largely agree with you here but I do believe the issue could be more specifically addressed, especially on a console platform which has much different mechanics than a task-kill. A simple inclusion of language to the effect of “any method of terminating the game other than the menu while engaged in combat with another player”. I do know that lawyers prefer vague clauses but i don’t really agree. Think some things should be spelled out to avoid creating ill-will.
Combat logging is admittance of defeat, sure. So hooray for you if someone does. But, The issue with it though is that the logger is actively exploiting the system to avoid game mechanic consequences such as lost data or cargo. So it becomes just another way for player interaction to be completely meaningless and continues to invalidate the "emergent gameplay" the devs have claimed to want
The problem is though, is killing for the sake of killing "emergent gameplay" or just being a bit awful to other players, because you can?
Who says what it's for the sake of? The reason doesn't really change the course of how it plays out. But to answer your question, yes. Considering murderhobo was an NPC archetype for a while.
You can figure out an RP reason to kill anyone. Literally. An rp reason is I want to instill fear/become infamous. Or your fed so all ships that are empire pledged, have empire modules, or fly imperial ships must die or your imp and the opposite is true. Or bgs reasons. Etc etc etc. Reasoning for the interaction can vary greatly and unless the attacker monologues his motive to you, motive/no motive are functionally the same.
The issue is circumventing game mechanics via force quitting.
Deleted member 251664
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log out timer should be proportionate to the integrity of the ship you are flying.
If there was a proper server the timer could be enforced for such proportionate time in case of unplugging cable/alt+f4.
People with crappy network would complain, but to play an online game having a good connection is a base requirement.
Never going to happen, majority of playerbase is too proud of their worthless pixels and goes against fd's policy "screw game quality, maximise profits with least effort".
If there was a proper server the timer could be enforced for such proportionate time in case of unplugging cable/alt+f4.
People with crappy network would complain, but to play an online game having a good connection is a base requirement.
Never going to happen, majority of playerbase is too proud of their worthless pixels and goes against fd's policy "screw game quality, maximise profits with least effort".
If there is no particular game outcome from the attack though, why is force quitting such an issue?
Won't read thru 7 pages, sorry if that's been said already.
There's a difference between menu c-log and other means of combat logging.
While the menu log is perfectly allowed but frowned upon by the PvP community (and others) the c-log with alt-F4/task kill/pulling the plug, is considered cheating and should be reported as such.
There's a difference between menu c-log and other means of combat logging.
While the menu log is perfectly allowed but frowned upon by the PvP community (and others) the c-log with alt-F4/task kill/pulling the plug, is considered cheating and should be reported as such.
Anybody who's unable to grasp the idea that task-killing a game in order to avoid consequences is probably too dumb to walk upright and, thus, will also be incapable of playing a game in the first place.
The only people who CL are people who KNOW it's wrong but do it anyway.
Regarding the EULA, I'd suggest the following articles may apply:-
3. Licence Restrictions
You are not permitted:
(c) [to] use cheats, automation software, hacks, mods, or any other unauthorized software designed to modify or defeat the purpose or experience of the Game;
In this context, the task-switching/task-killing capability of your OS could be considered as being able to "modify or defeat the purpose or experience of the Game".
Obviously, the OS, itself, is not "unauthorised software" but it's up to FDev to decide whether or not a feature of the OS is "unauthorised" or not.
4. Acceptable Use Restrictions
4.1 You may not use the Game or any Online Features in any unlawful manner, for any unlawful purpose, or in any manner inconsistent with this EULA, or act fraudulently or maliciously, including but not limited to hacking into, inserting malicious code (including viruses or harmful data) into the Game, any Online Features or any operating system.
4.4 You may not use the Game or any Online Features in a manner that could damage, disable, impair, overburden or compromise our systems or security or interfere with the experience of other users of the Game or any Online Feature.
It could be argued that task-killing the game contravenes S4.1 in terms of acting in a "fraudulent or malicious" manner.
This clause appears primarily intended to address illegal activities but it could be argued that task-killing is either fraudulent or malicious.
Equally, I'd suggest it's almost indisputable that task-killing contravenes S4.4 in that a player is "Using the game in a manner that could interfere with the experience of other users of the game".
That's pretty clear-cut, IMO.
8. Termination
8.1 Without prejudice to any other rights, Frontier may terminate this EULA immediately without notice if you fail to comply with the terms and conditions of this EULA. In the event of termination, all rights granted to you under this EULA shall cease and you must destroy all copies of the Game and all of its component parts (including any Game stored on the hard disk of any device). All provisions of this EULA relating to disclaimers or warranties, limitations of liability, remedies, damages, Frontier’s proprietary rights and/or any terms intended expressly or by implication to survive termination or expiry shall survive termination, including, without limitation Clauses 3-5, and 10-12.
You break the rules (as listed above) then we can kick you out.
10. Limitation of Liability; Remedies
10.6 If you breach or threaten to breach any provision in this EULA, you agree that Frontier shall be irreparably harmed, and, without any additional findings of irreparable injury or harm or other considerations of public policy, Frontier shall be entitled to receive an injunction compelling specific performance by you of your obligations under this EULA without the necessity of posting any bond or other security.
If you break the EULA, you accept that you're doing stuff that might be considered harmful to FDev and they can take legal action as a result of this.
Clearly, this is all pretty unlikely (aside from having your butt kicked out of the game - which is only marginally more likely) but it'd be wrong to assume FDev DON'T have the tools to support any action taken against cheats.
Honestly I have no idea why this is even a thing. Games with more formalised combat arenas such as The Crucible in Destiny 2 correctly punishes people for force quitting in the middle of a competitive activity. Granted it's more of a mild chiding and the loss of a bit of your rank. (even if it was your ISP deciding that now would be a great time to remotely reboot your modem, or take the line down for a 2 hour long repair session.)
For Elite to take the same type of measures though we'd probably need something like a dedicated combat arena with say team based pvp and... oh, wait that's what that cqc thing is I think. Huh. If only people ever queued up for it in my time zone...
For Elite to take the same type of measures though we'd probably need something like a dedicated combat arena with say team based pvp and... oh, wait that's what that cqc thing is I think. Huh. If only people ever queued up for it in my time zone...
Logging out the game , which EVERY single player does anyway , does NOT break any of those rules lol.
exactly. A lot of the time Clogging is used I believe is when it's due to seal-clubbing, NOT competitive activity.