External View [A definitive discussion]

[noodle]

My objections, however, is regarding sort of "carpet bombing" forums with threads about 3rd person view.

I rest my case. This has nothing to do with the thread at hand. If you want to complain about it, complain about it to the mods and stop derailing the discussion that other people are trying to have. Pretty please with a cherry on top

 

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

You mostly say "it's not going to happen", "it's too late", etc. etc. That contributes nothing to this discussion. As I understand it, we're trying to arrive at a sensible consensus regarding what people want. That's the conversation you should be contributing to if you're participating in this thread. Whether FD do or don't ultimately implement that consensus is entirely up to them.

With all due respect noodle, I will disagree.

My opinion about this thread and subject in matter is as valid as those who think it should be like Freelancer 3rd person view. They can disagree with my POV too. As I said, just my opinion. However it is based on quotes from FD developers.

And it contributes to discussion a lot, effectively ending it in my opinion.

 

[NeilF]

I've added a "What we do know" section to the OP.

I suspect there's people here who are aware of posts/information that I'm not. If you think you have something (eg: a link/quote) please let me know and I'll add it

 

[noodle]

With all due respect noodle, I will disagree.

My opinion about this thread and subject in matter is as valid as those who think it should be like Freelancer 3rd person view. They can disagree with my POV too. As I said, just my opinion. However it is based on quotes from FD developers.

And it contributes to discussion a lot, effectively ending it in my opinion.

Your opinion is absolutely valid. Shouting it in everyone's face when they're trying to discuss a different opinion is a bit rude though.

 

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

Your opinion is absolutely valid. Shouting it in everyone's face when they're trying to discuss a different opinion is a bit rude though.

Bringing disappointing news is well...disappointing, but it is not shouting. I prefer honesty too, because lot of people on General don't have access neither to PBF or Alpha forums, and aren't aware about what's FD status with 3rd person view is.

But I think I have said enough. No point to repeat myself, that's true. Off I go

 

[NeilF]

Guys... This is exactly what I didn't want

If you do or don't want an external view, there's no reason to argue. My goal with this thread (or the OP) is:-
a) To point out what people might like out of any external view option.
b) Point out how we might offer this without impacting on gameplay.
c) Address any common concerns about gameplay.
d) Show FD's current thinking/comments on the matter.

Hopefully it will prove a one stop shop for a lot of people new to this question/matter...

I understand there are strong feelings about it, but let's just move on and try and be constructive

Even if that OP is a pointless exercise in addressing the matter, it might at least prove an interesting/insightful read to some... and may prevent some future thread discussing the matter again...

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

Whats the point in having an external view when you cant do anything with it? In that case, might as well just have a model view of your ships in the menu and not even bother to see it in game. External views have been a part of gaming since whenever it was possible to do. Just because the original Elite didn't have it due to technical limitations, trying to impose that on a 21st century title is silly. There is a large community of people who love to make movies from the games they play and to totally deny them or try to fob them off with a useless drone view is actually insulting. Like I said there will be a huge 'HUH?!?!??' when the game reaches the wider public audience. It doesn't take a huge amount of dev time to implement a view system either, especially for the geniuses at FD since they did it on the Amiga games!
Such a beautiful game and we only get to view it from the cockpit? What a travesty...

The sad bottom line for you is that, this has been made pretty clear from the off, and is unlikely to change. Perhaps this game is not for you and you should consider 1 which is.

I am not trying to have a pop, it is just the reality of the situation. As I understand it, you are not interested in any compromises and just want a fully featured controllable any view any time mode. This is not going to happen, the devs have said so in no uncertain terms.

some of the suggestions in this thread may happen, but given they are clearly not good enough for you then it will probably be less frustrating for you if you just move on, or just accept it.

It is not a technical limitation, it is a design choice, kind of like I-Racing where they made the same decision for presumably the same reasons

 

[noodle]

Bringing disappointing news is well...disappointing, but it is not shouting.

I don't find it disappointing because:

1. I really don't care that much about a videogame.
2. FD have made it clear nothing is set in stone.
3. I really don't care that much about a videogame.

You can't bring "news", because you are not representative of FD. You have interpreted their position one way, others have interpreted it another way. So it is your opinion that you are repeating at every opportunity, regardless of whether or not it's appropriate to the discussion.

 

[Mazhurg]

Guys... This is exactly what I didn't want

So then, we can expect a new thread on the subject again?

 

[NeilF]

So then, we can expect a new thread on the subject again?

I'm posting "External View [A more definitive discussion]" right now!

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

I'm posting "External View [A more definitive discussion]" right now!

Dear god.... you are joking...... right?

 

[Crayfish]

I am not trying to have a pop, it is just the reality of the situation. As I understand it, you are not interested in any compromises and just want a fully featured any view any time mode. This is not going to happen, the devs have said so in no uncertain terms.

That may be so, but product designers that completely ignore all consumer feedback are doomed in the long run.

So accepting that FD have said that there will be no third person view and moving on..

My query is whether there will be any way to see the exterior of our own ships? Whilst docked in the hanger or, ideally, when landed on a planet.

This is important because of *ship pr0n*. If you manage to get an awesome ship with some rare upgrades you will really want to sit back and admire it occasionally.

 

[Rog]

I have no objections with current plans about handling 3rd person view in ED.

Does this mean you are happy with a handicapped camera-drone, or your interpretation of no external view at all (which isn't what the devs have said)?

My opinion about this thread and subject in matter is as valid as those who think it should be like Freelancer 3rd person view.

Pecisk, absolutely no-one wants an arcade 3rd-person view like in Freelancer!

Example of what NOBODY wants:


To be as clear as I can be: NO-ONE is asking for what you seem bothered about. I certainly don't want that to even be included as an option.

 

[JeffRyan]

*sigh*

Personally I'd suggest wading into a thread - that's attempting to be constructive (be it successful or not) - to do nothing more than have an nonconstructive dig is bad form.

But this is the internet of course, so it's to sadly be expected at times :S

I said bad form because you waded into my thread on the exact same topic (we happen to agree) but the thread wasn't reacting the way you wanted. So you created another. On the exact same topic. And then you berate others. Like I said, bad form whether I agree with you or not.

 

[NeilF]

or your interpretation of no external view at all (which isn't what the devs have said)?

It would seem odd that we have these ships with all this external detail rendered, including personal decals and the like (we've paid for?), which potentially we can't (easily) see :S

 

[noodle]

I said bad form because you waded into my thread on the exact same topic (we happen to agree) but the thread wasn't reacting the way you wanted. So you created another. On the exact same topic. And then you berate others. Like I said, bad form whether I agree with you or not.

This conversation is getting extremely abstract. We'll need lawyers to sort it out soon.

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

That may be so, but product designers that completely ignore all consumer feedback are doomed in the long run.

So accepting that FD have said that there will be no third person view and moving on..

My query is whether there will be any way to see the exterior of our own ships? Whilst docked in the hanger or, ideally, when landed on a planet.

This is important because of *ship pr0n*. If you manage to get an awesome ship with some rare upgrades you will really want to sit back and admire it occasionally.

according to what others have said, who have access to the DDF, (I dont so this is just what I read here) there will be a drone of some description offering some of that

 

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

Does this mean you are happy with a handicapped camera-drone, or your interpretation of no external view at all (which isn't what the devs have said)?

Please don't put your words in my mouth. I never said there won't be external view. I said we will have handicapped camera drone. I said I don't know details, obviously, but I assume FD will allow to capture full screen pictures or maybe even videos with it. Nothing else nothing more.

Pecisk, absolutely no-one wants an arcade 3rd-person view like in Freelancer!

Read some posts previously - they clearly asked for it

 

[NeilF]

I said bad form because you waded into my thread on the exact same topic (we happen to agree) but the thread wasn't reacting the way you wanted. So you created another. On the exact same topic. And then you berate others. Like I said, bad form whether I agree with you or not.

As said, my intention with this thread is an attempt (successful or not) to try and prevent numerous threads covering, and recovering, the same questions and answers over and over. That's my hope at least.

As for your other points:-
1) I'm not aware of doing that, and I apologise if that's how it's been perceived.
2) Coming into a completely separate thread, seemingly to do nothing more than "settle a score" clearly isn't productive.

Dear god.... you are joking...... right?

Yes... The OP in this thread is what I'll keep up to date as best I can.

 

[Rog]

Please don't put your words in my mouth. I never said there won't be external view. I said we will have handicapped camera drone. I said I don't know details, obviously, but I assume FD will allow to capture full screen pictures or maybe even videos with it. Nothing else nothing more.

Read some posts previously - they clearly asked for it

Ok... I wasn't trying to put words in your mouth, I got the distinct impression that you thought FD weren't going to provide any external view mechanism at all.

So, if the devs ARE going to provide a nerfed camera drone, what the hell is all the frank exchanging of views about?

As for the 'Freelancer' arcade view mode, I think I saw one mild request for that. The vast majority do not want it, and I really don't think we are going to get it.