Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
Thanks for the clarification.
It is, but it's also the one that appears, to me at least, to cause the most friction among the player-base.
How Open-only would balance ED
I think nuking open would be better tbh. Borked MP bolt-ons have ruined game balance, imo.
This guy gets it:
GIFT is why the modes exist. It isn't just about PvP, it's about all the myriad ways players who either get off of ruining the experience of others, or are so utterly ignorant or uncaring of common courtesy that they come off that way, are able to disrupt the game.
Yes, it may be neat the first time you find yourself waiting in line to for your turn at an outpost's medium landing pad, but it doesn't take long before one too many line jumpers, pad hogs, "blockades," and all the other ways simply gets annoying. The modes remove those most sensitive to GIFT-like behavior from the proverbial audience, those who get off of deliberately ruining the gaming experience of others either get bored by the lack of salt, or get frustrated by the abundance of and armed response, and also leave for greener pastures.
That leaves the ignorant and uncaring. With a smaller Open cohort, the ignorant can be taught, and with enough time and firepower, the uncaring can also be taught... or get frustrated and also leave for greener pastures.
At least, that's been my experience in this game, compared to other open-PvP games that feature heavyily PvE oriented play. Seriously, Open in this game is a paradise compared to similar games I played, at least before the devs threw up their hands and put in a hard-coded barrier between PvPers and everyone else.
Yes, it may be neat the first time you find yourself waiting in line to for your turn at an outpost's medium landing pad, but it doesn't take long before one too many line jumpers, pad hogs, "blockades," and all the other ways simply gets annoying. The modes remove those most sensitive to GIFT-like behavior from the proverbial audience, those who get off of deliberately ruining the gaming experience of others either get bored by the lack of salt, or get frustrated by the abundance of and armed response, and also leave for greener pastures.
That leaves the ignorant and uncaring. With a smaller Open cohort, the ignorant can be taught, and with enough time and firepower, the uncaring can also be taught... or get frustrated and also leave for greener pastures.
At least, that's been my experience in this game, compared to other open-PvP games that feature heavyily PvE oriented play. Seriously, Open in this game is a paradise compared to similar games I played, at least before the devs threw up their hands and put in a hard-coded barrier between PvPers and everyone else.
My solution this sort of problem would be that the game should spawn NPC ships that does what players does. so even if you switch to SOLO/PG, you would still have to wait for a landing spot etc.
And this could be expanded to if I start to mass hunt "clean" ships in a system, that would mean that for all players visiting this system, there would be NPC spawning doing the same. And if those players started to hunt these "rogue" NPC's, I would get NPC starting to chase me, other than the authority ships, etc
So basically if a system is really busy with lots of players, we should see lots of NPC's flying around too, doing what we do... so now yuou have to choose, wait 10 minutes for the landing pad to free, or go to an alterantive place where you will make less profit, but can land without delay!
I liked it before you added that last bit, honest!I think nuking open would be better tbh. Borked MP bolt-ons have ruined game balance, imo.
I'll say it before and I'll say it again: everyone who buys ED should have two accounts, sorry, 'Saves' . One is tied toOpen. But there, it's a wilderness. Everything goes. And the BGS in one mode is not the same as another.
Everyone happy. Hifiveyeah
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I kind of agree with you - the vast majority of MMOs have only one mode. On top of that, most MMOs are pay to win - therefore, all players; noobs, experienced pros and even players who spend hundreds of real money on in-game items get put onto one server and have to face each other. Obviously it is brutal. However in Elite, everyone has access to more or less the same equipment, so making one mode only is logical.
However I do understand that some people simply don't want to face other, potentially hostile players against their will, so a comprise would be keep only two modes - Open and Private Group with a clear line between them. The ability to block players should be removed, and should be used only for text communication. Furthermore, if someone logs out in open (and in PG, if the PG owner enables this feature) their ship should stay in that instance for 5-10 minutes to prevent combat logging, like its done in other games. No "timer/exit to menu is ok" rubbish. This keeps everyone happy - players who are willing to have a risk of encountering potentially hostile players and not combat log when this happens go to Open - they can't choose who they face, while players who don't want to face hostile players or want to pick and choose who they can encounter go to a PG.
I don't think that forcing people who don't want to play open play open is a good idea, because this will only promote combat logging and increase forum salt, but there should be two clear options, one of which the player can take depending on their attitude.
TLDR; Make a slightly more streamlined mode choice.
However I do understand that some people simply don't want to face other, potentially hostile players against their will, so a comprise would be keep only two modes - Open and Private Group with a clear line between them. The ability to block players should be removed, and should be used only for text communication. Furthermore, if someone logs out in open (and in PG, if the PG owner enables this feature) their ship should stay in that instance for 5-10 minutes to prevent combat logging, like its done in other games. No "timer/exit to menu is ok" rubbish. This keeps everyone happy - players who are willing to have a risk of encountering potentially hostile players and not combat log when this happens go to Open - they can't choose who they face, while players who don't want to face hostile players or want to pick and choose who they can encounter go to a PG.
I don't think that forcing people who don't want to play open play open is a good idea, because this will only promote combat logging and increase forum salt, but there should be two clear options, one of which the player can take depending on their attitude.
TLDR; Make a slightly more streamlined mode choice.
If the game was Open only... I'd stop playing. I only ever play in Solo and wouldn't do anything else, Elite is supposed to be relaxing for me, not a constant worry about some d***wad spoiling things for me.
Observer effect.
Propose any change or any non-change, and the friction quickly becomes apparent. Just watch what happens when someone suggests the game should have an economy, that NPCs should be smarter than bag of stones, or that there should be consequences for x!
I see your point.
However, it is fundamentally flawed.
Let's start from the ground up.
This is a game that is strictly limited in its capacity to host multiple players in the same instance.
Consequently, it can never be compared to a "reality" like you're attempting to do.
Even in Open mode, in the very busy of busiest systems there will be multiple, multiple shards of the same game world (called Instances), effectively making the "Open only" argument redundant... Because there may be several Open instances of the same system or station. You may as well be in a PG, because you'll never see all of the players at the same location in Open anyway.
You just have to acknowledge and accept that the game has technical limitations that mean that gold rush concept that you are revolving your argument around will, in the game world, never be able to simulate the volume of people inhabiting a real life "gold rush".
Open only would create a more organic situation of some players accepting lower sell prices in safer less known Systems. Freeing up landing pads in high risk, high reward ones.
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
I've been "observing" the friction between PvE and PvP players for a long time now - since before the game was launched.
Fun fact: the first Mobius PG was created some time before the game launched.
Quite - it is increasingly apparent that we don't all want the same things.
Oh great, more game trolling. No thanks.
Sick of NPC ships spawning as I'm leaving some station in my Cutter. Like, it's my game, I'm real and you're pixels, naff off already!
I play open only, gank occasionally and send everyone o7 too.
And?
Also open only is bad for people who want to be left alone.
There should be an incentive to play in open, but not open only.
Players wanting different things is less of a problem than the game trying to pretend it can do justice to every preference.
Like, it's my game, I'm real and you're pixels, naff off already!
That's the thing though. It's not just your game.
Or we could, I dunno, get rid of the get rich quick schemes. Even by their "semi-real" sim standards it makes zero sense that the trillions of tons of diamonds mined haven't even made the slightest dent in the desire to buy them. They saw fit to nerf Vopal prices, why are LTDs sacrosanct?
If you are under the impression that Solo is a single player mode, you are grossly mistaken.
You have at least the same agency (arguably more) over the setting we all share in Solo as in any other mode. If you get to play by your own personal set of rules, and they happen to make things easier or faster for you, you get a leg up on everyone else.
For the game to be fair, the same rules have to apply to everyone.
Don't talk utter twaddle.
How am I necessarily getting a 'leg up' on other people because I have to be stuck behind come-from-nowhere npcs in an empty, tiny station?!? Nonsense.
Let's limit people to 15 hours a week play, capped at that, because some people work long hours and we don't want them to get a 'leg up'???
Or let's change everything back to five years ago because new players can get a 'leg up' on older.
Makes as much sense=0.
And in a universe with unlimited LTD, engineering, credits, ships, no limits on number who can be Elite... WHAT LEG-UP could you be talking about???
Maybe it's just me today, but I really don't get where you are coming from.at all. I bet when you play, you don't think "oh, I'd better be fair to Tiger". Neither should you. Play the game your way, and have fun. o7
How am I necessarily getting a 'leg up' on other people because I have to be stuck behind come-from-nowhere npcs in an empty, tiny station?!? Nonsense.
Let's limit people to 15 hours a week play, capped at that, because some people work long hours and we don't want them to get a 'leg up'???
Or let's change everything back to five years ago because new players can get a 'leg up' on older.
Makes as much sense=0.
And in a universe with unlimited LTD, engineering, credits, ships, no limits on number who can be Elite... WHAT LEG-UP could you be talking about???
Maybe it's just me today, but I really don't get where you are coming from.at all. I bet when you play, you don't think "oh, I'd better be fair to Tiger". Neither should you. Play the game your way, and have fun. o7
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