I would say that elite dangerous was designed with pvp combat in mind, plus plenty of other activities. The only real common denominator in the game is the BGS, which is affected by everyone, open or solo, pc, Xbox or ps4.
Question for Open players who don't like PVP/ganking... help me understand
- Thread starter Danquememe
- Start date
Important questions remain!
Does OP understand by now? Wasn't that the initial point of the thread?
Perhaps another hundred or so pages of explanation are needed?
Interesting. I always had the feeling that PvP was the last thing on the developers' minds when they were designing how combat would work.
The common denominator, the BGS, works through PvE activities, not PvP.
It was sarcasm..
The fact that there is an open mode where PvP is allowed means that it was designed into the game as far as I'm concerned, and the flight model is highly regarded for PvP (and PvE). You can affect the BGS via PvP, as long as the parties involved agree to it. My squadron is open only, as is one of our neighboring rival groups, so we have fairly frequent conficts.
![[PS4] Lorenzo Waringos](https://forums-cdn.zaonce.net/data/avatars/m/234/234580.jpg?1612617334){kind=avatar}
I missed that, apologies.
There is a world of difference between having something be possible and actually desigining it with careful thought, which is i thought you meant, rather than just meaning hey, it can happen, therefore its designed. Its perhaps the weakest meaning of the word designed.
The fact that there is an instancing system whereby players can meet other players, and can be identified as such (via the hollow square) is much more than 'it can happen'.
Frontier could easily have only allowed collabarative mechanics such as multi-crew while not allowing you to instance with other players in separate ships. Maybe they live in a different reality bubble where nobody shoots at anybody else, but I seriously doubt it.
But, but, we are supposed to build our Miners, Explorers and Haulers with the expectation of combat, regardless of whether that affects our gameplay, just to keep the Combat types happy..
Well, you are supposed to expect combat. The Elite series always had combat central, as do the trailers, books and so forth.
You might argue the game is poorly balanced and the gap between pure combat and multirole is too large. I'd agree. But not preparing for combat at all is just silly and not befitting a proper Cmdr.
Deleted member 182079
D
Unless you weigh off risk/reward and the probability of running into hostiles, which is extremely low when exploring on your own, but not so much while taking part in organised events such as DW (as DG proved).
My fleet consists mostly of ships that could withstand a gank attack or three - though actually being able to push back I have maybe a couple - but there are some ships that I built specifically and solely for PvE - if I get caught in those in Open (where I fly almost all of the time) then unless I can outmaneuver hollow triangles in SC, I have to accept that if they catch me I will see the rebuy screen.
Another who thought I was being serious.. lol
There are plenty of stuff you can do with other players in ED that doesn't involve PvP. Almost all those activities also gives a bonus to everyone in the wing.
Sure, but that wasn't really my point
Deleted member 182079
D
Unfortunately there are situations where going Solo improves the gameplay experience when it comes to non-combat PvP stuff.
The burning stations are a good example - you're better off playing in Solo if you want to be productive - other players might have hoovered up the canisters & mats inside the station, and large pads are constantly blocked because everyone and their dog must fly a Conda//T9/T7/Orca/Beluga/Cutter and there's only 1 large pad available on the rescue ship.
It was quite funny to see an actual queue of ships patiently waiting for their turn though, so there's that. I was just glad I wasn't one of them.
The burning stations are a good example - you're better off playing in Solo if you want to be productive - other players might have hoovered up the canisters & mats inside the station, and large pads are constantly blocked because everyone and their dog must fly a Conda//T9/T7/Orca/Beluga/Cutter and there's only 1 large pad available on the rescue ship.
It was quite funny to see an actual queue of ships patiently waiting for their turn though, so there's that. I was just glad I wasn't one of them.
I think you misunderstand what I meant when i'm talking about "designed".
To give an example, the disparity in combat ability between small ships and big ships that was compounded when they added multiple modules that increased toughness as well as engineering.
I don't think anyone sat down and "designed" them from the point of view of PvP combat. Nobody said, ok, what happens if guy A in this Corvette meets guy B in this Cobra. Is there any sort of balance here?
My personal feeling is that bigger ships should actuallty struggle killing smaller ships more than they do (especially Corvette with its ridiculously high agility for its size).
Likewise with combat ship with trade ships. Of course i don't expect trade ships to beat combat ships in general. But how combat ships and wipe a trade ship configured for trade in a matter is seconds is a major PvP imbalance from my point of view.
Yes yes, someone will now post Rinzler's video. Very good, we've all seen it.
I think trade ships, knowing they will be going out into the black and facing potential pirates should be a lot tougher than they are by default.
Now, you might disagree with my individual points here as to what would make PvP better designed, but i hope you agree that it seems like FD didn't actually put any design thought into combat in relation to PvP, especially when they added engineers and all the extra modules.
You're now moving the discussion to the lack of balance - the fact that PvP is not well balanced due to engineering (I agree by the way) is not the same as saying that fdev didn't design Elite Dangerous with PvP in mind. Not to mention the fact that the engineers came after PvP already existed.
I agree with what you're saying but I think the lack of design is more fundamental.
ED is kind of like a Decathlon event where the scoring system means that means you only get points for the 100m sprint.
You can be the best athlete in the world at the other 9 events but the only way you're going to win is if you win the 100m.
How it might be possible to expand the range of interactions further, of course, is anybody's guess.
I agree with what you're saying but I think the lack of design is more fundamental.
ED is kind of like a Decathlon event where the scoring system means that means you only get points for the 100m sprint.
You can be the best athlete in the world at the other 9 events but the only way you're going to win is if you win the 100m.
How it might be possible to expand the range of interactions further, of course, is anybody's guess.
Oh sure, if we expand the discussion wider we can dissect many areas of the game and offer our criticisms. I think the thread, at 172 pages, is probably already covering enough ground though
And i would say that at the start things were better, much better although I still would not say they designed combat with PvP in mind. Also, some of those pre-beta weapons were OP as hell, but we can forgive those since it was alpha. Having said that, as i understand, there are some people still flying around with those weapons....