Sidechat

[KönigDerKaffeebohnen]

Read an article today about the cat hunting laws in one of the german states at the coast (schleswig holstein).
Hunters there are allowed to shoot cats if they are further away from the next hiuse then 200 meters and its inside a registerd hunting zone.
Schleswig Holstein is a breeding site fir many endangerd bird species, so the hunters and nature activists there are very keen on keeping the amounts of potentially hunting cats in these designated areas low, even if it means killing pets and ngl they are right.
The article started with a tear jerker about a poor poor women traumatise because two of her poor poor sweet cats got shot by hunters, but shes living right next to a nature Reserve and she still let her cats outside unsupervised to stray around.
Yeah ofcourse it sucks that her pet got shot, but its hard to give her sympathy when its her fault for letting her pet go outside to do as he please unsupervised and its even worse that it happend aggain.
You think if one cat got shot for going inside the Reserve that you wouldnt let your next cat be a free roamer but nope.

Like comeone how am i suppoused to have sympathy for her when she is the one that doomed the cats, nor the hunter that pulled the trigger.
Ofcourse she meant well, but especally after the first one got shot youd think shed learn from her mistake but no

 

[Villanelle]

Read an article today about the cat hunting laws in one of the german states at the coast (schleswig holstein).
Hunters there are allowed to shoot cats if they are further away from the next hiuse then 200 meters and its inside a registerd hunting zone.
Schleswig Holstein is a breeding site fir many endangerd bird species, so the hunters and nature activists there are very keen on keeping the amounts of potentially hunting cats in these designated areas low, even if it means killing pets and ngl they are right.
The article started with a tear jerker about a poor poor women traumatise because two of her poor poor sweet cats got shot by hunters, but shes living right next to a nature Reserve and she still let her cats outside unsupervised to stray around.
Yeah ofcourse it sucks that her pet got shot, but its hard to give her sympathy when its her fault for letting her pet go outside to do as he please unsupervised and its even worse that it happend aggain.
You think if one cat got shot for going inside the Reserve that you wouldnt let your next cat be a free roamer but nope.

Like comeone how am i suppoused to have sympathy for her when she is the one that doomed the cats, nor the hunter that pulled the trigger.
Ofcourse she meant well, but especally after the first one got shot youd think shed learn from her mistake but no

Wow. That law wouldn't pass in the UK...pets are considered family here. My sympathy lies with the woman here...I'd be heartbroken and outraged if someone shot my pet. I'd want to grab their gun and point it right at them.

I appreciate that birds and small mammals need to be protected from domestic cats that are hunters. But aren't there other ways, such as bells on collars that could be mandatory? Keeping cats in at night is another compromise that can help.

My family always had pet cats and we always put bells on their collars but let them roam free outside. We didn't live next to a nature reserve. I had one cat that was an excellent hunter and got mice and voles regularly but a bird only once because of the bell and it was probably an old or sick bird. Usually she brought the mice in alive and unharmed and I'd catch them and release them. My mum's current cat is too derpy to catch anything...a lot of pet cats are.

New Zealand is an exceptional case and I understand why it wants to phase out having any cats on the island altogether. Hate the sound of their cat hunting 'festival' though.

Idk. It's a tricky issue and you do have to appreciate that cats are to some people what dogs are to others, and that some cats are not indoor cats and will be miserable if kept indoors.

 

[Marvinb]

Ah yes the free roaming cat issue
We had something similar ish here. Had a friend living some cities aways with a nature reserve nearby and people got heavily advised to keep their cats indoors, especially in spring. Reasons being that there were alot of pairs of multiple endangered birds breeding there including eagle owls, so the cats should stay indoors to not kill any of the birds and get preyed on by the owls.
Ofcourse people being people didnt listen, so alot of birds and cats payed the price over the years with the only benefiters being the owls.

I dont have anything against cats, but the choice between them free roaming and the countless species they are driving to extinction is a rather easy one for me.
But luckily there are options from catios to walking them on a leash, so i dearly hope that those get more popular in the future

 

[Marvinb]

On the topic of endangered birds, the slender billed curlew got declared extinct the other day marking it the first european mainland bird to got extinct, aswell as the third overall after the great auk and the canary oystercatcher. Super sad news

 

[KönigDerKaffeebohnen]

Wow. That law wouldn't pass in the UK...pets are considered family here. My sympathy lies with the woman here...I'd be heartbroken and outraged if someone shot my pet. I'd want to grab their gun and point it right at them.

I appreciate that birds and small mammals need to be protected from domestic cats that are hunters. But aren't there other ways, such as bells on collars that could be mandatory? Keeping cats in at night is another compromise that can help.

My family always had pet cats and we always put bells on their collars but let them roam free outside. We didn't live next to a nature reserve. I had one cat that was an excellent hunter and got mice and voles regularly but a bird only once because of the bell and it was probably an old or sick bird. Usually she brought the mice in alive and unharmed and I'd catch them and release them. My mum's current cat is too derpy to catch anything...a lot of pet cats are.

New Zealand is an exceptional case and I understand why it wants to phase out having any cats on the island altogether. Hate the sound of their cat hunting 'festival' though.

Idk. It's a tricky issue and you do have to appreciate that cats are to some people what dogs are to others, and that some cats are not indoor cats and will be miserable if kept indoors.

Ofcourse cats and any other pets are family, but this is a clear case of unnessecary violence BECAUSE of the neglecene of the cat owner.

Its never the animals fault, allways the owners, that goes for bad behaving dogs aswell as for hunting cats and when the choice is between not letting the cat outside unsupervisided to make sure that they stay in the save area and not go on a killing spree, especally not on endangerd species, or risking straight up death for both your cat and the wild critters of the area there is a clear morally correct option here and its to keep the cat supervised or inside.

Even if the animals killed by the cats are not endangerd, those mice, voles, songbirds and whatever else they catch are still creatures unnessecarly killed.

Ofcourse shooting the cat is a harsh punishment, but what else are they suppoused to do?
The cat owners know the risk and still let them out and just in general allow their cats to activly take lifes whenever they let them free roam, which is just straight up a-moral.
And if you dont have the room to house a cat without letting then free roam then perhaps the person should just not get a cat.

The general public opinion goes easy on cats cause they are cute and the damage they cause is just a number to most but that doesnt change the fact that domestic cats are the number 1 cause of death for small critters in any urban or suburban setting, with every single one of these deaths being completly preventable if cat owners would actually take responsibility and keep their cats inside or only letting them out supervised.

Another thing to point out is the change in public perception if a dog does it.
While for cats killing things is expected, if a non registerd hunting dog catches a bird or bunny thats something negative.
In spring and early summer when young deer are hiding in the meadows and fields near forests, dog owners are required to take them on a leash to ensure that no dog harms any fawn and any responsible dog owner follows suit, simply because its the right thing to do.

To own a pet means to take responsibility of them, including their actions and in no case should the unnessecary harming and killing of wild animals through those pets just be brushed of.
Its in the responsibility of the owner to ensure that the pet causes no harm and if they cant accomplish that they are not suited to keep the pet.
And if the pet is causing active harm to others and/or the enviroment they should be taken away, and if to protect people and/or the enviroment and all other steps of information, disobeyed rules and laws and it is still causing issues, then taking down the pet is the reasoable outcome, even if tragic.
I doubt many people would disagree that shooting a dog that is about to maul a person is a reasonable action to take, prioritising the well being of the victim over the life of the agressor.
And a cat straying into a hunting zone, especally one that houses endangerd potential prey, is just as much a danger to the wild animals living there if not more then the dog mauling a person.

It really isnt even a complex issue, for the sake of both the cats and any other living beeing in the area around the owners house the cat shouldnt be allowed to roam freely and if you let that happen, especally if you know that your cat can pay the price by being shot, then your just simply a bad owner that didnt take responsibility for their pets actions and neglected to keep them and the enviroment around you save.

 

[KoenZoo]

This is one of the reasons I created a "cat aviary" for my two cats. Not that were I live we have so many birds/mouses which are low in numbers, but I'm also not looking forward to the day that they start bringing in their prey to show me. Friends I have already had cases where they brought in mouses which were still alive, frogs, birds, ... Not for me! Also nice to play Planet Zoo is my backyard

But I also read about this topic here in The Netherlands and there it was also mentioned that even killing the stray cats didn't help that much, since a lot of the birds are also killed by foxes. But yeah stray/"wild" cats are a serious problem. We have around 1,5 mil of these in The Netherlands.

 

[Villanelle]

That cat aviary is incredible! You've got mad skills!

I'm going to struggle to agree with you @KönigDerKaffeebohnen because I'm against hunting in general anyway. So I'll never accept that shooting a cat that has wandered into a reserve or hunting zone is okay. I absolutely agree that it's always the owner at fault, not the animal. I just disagree with the punishment.

And yeah obviously as self defense, anything is permitted, but I don't think carrying guns is okay anywhere so it wouldn't be by shooting in my utopia.

I think there are two more things to consider:

1. What percentage of wild bird deaths are caused by domestic cats? What about stray cats? What are the numbers? There are many other reasons that wild birds are threatened. Habitat loss, agriculture, climate change, light pollution, pesticides, endless bird flu... As far as I'm aware, domestic cats are a major issue for urban garden birds, less so for woodland / rural / migratory species. And if harsh pesticides were banned and the climate was more under control and there was more forest and wild greenery... honestly I don't think the cat population would be an issue. Are we scapegoating cats because all these other problems are too big to solve?

2. Different cats have different temperaments and different needs. Some are okay with being indoors. Some really are not, and I do believe it's animal cruelty to keep them indoors or confined. I've had a cat that absolutely needed her freedom and another that was a couch potato.

Yes, cats are hunters. I personally don't see a huge problem with this if the prey animals are common things like mice...these animals breed quickly and have lost almost all their other natural predators in urban areas. It's not nice but it's nature. Industrial farming for meat is much, much uglier to me. If the point is about the unnecessary deaths and cruelty, I'd look first to the beef and pork industry.

Anyway it's okay to have different opinions, I won't argue about anything. It's an interesting case and I don't envy law makers who have to figure out the solutions for these problems. I'm glad not to have that responsibility! I do like living in a world with cats as pets though and I would struggle to ever keep a cat confined but I'd also hate to have a negative impact on my surroundings so I'll stick to dogs for now...maybe a lazy old cat in the future but maybe not, as I am also concerned about disappearing birds.

 

[QueenCinna]

I was previously living on a massive sheep station out in south West Qld, a good 60+ kms away from any towns and such, pest control was part of my duties there. In a span of 12 months I removed 250 odd feral cats - definitely not owned out there, and I am a below average hunter. They're that bad in the middle of nowhere where towns are hundreds of kilometres apart, they would be much worse in heavily populated areas.

Rabbits, pigs, goats, and foxes were also targets.

This is a pastoral station, so the land is turned into giant paddocks and no crops are grown, stock is rotated through each paddock to give the vegetation time to rest and regrow. The owners are interested in regenerative agricultural and it shows, they've restored a lot of the natural waterways, lots of invasive species targeting for plants and animals, tonnes of native plants being planted each year. There was over 300 species living on the property last time they did a count, Including dingo, emu, major Mitchell cockatoos, perentie, wedge tail eagle, Brolga, and a whole lot more

 

[FoxyDee]

Ah, another heavy topic. I understand both sides, but it is difficult. Anyone that owns a dog or cat and take them for a family member instead of just a tool (eg. guard dog, shepherd etc.) will have a hard time justifing shooting them, even if we feel sorry for the wildlife. The connection to these pet animals is just too strong even if we know one animal is not better than the other and they are all equal.

 

[NZFanatic]

As a cat owner, nah, the native birds take precedence. I love my stupid idiot cats but if I lived anywhere near a native bird hot-spot I simply wouldn't own cats. It's just plain irresponsible. I don't live near a native bird hot-spot (we do get native birds, but they don't breed anywhere near us) and my cats still have bells on their collars and are trapped indoors at night. They still bring home the occasional bird (just sparrows mostly, and those are pests so it doesn't matter). Getting rid of the cats is the most obvious solution. Pets or no, they are an invasive species.

Anyway, today I learned that ChatGPT is actually really useful for dumbing-down scholarly articles, so I've been deep-diving into studies about Pleistocene wildlife, which has been fun, and it's convinced me to start a sort of speculative zoology project.

 

[Mr-Hyrax 2]

my rank all scenery for a dlc post ready, go check it out

Rank EVERY scenery piece for a dlc

Getting it done, should be ready by Friday, get ready to vote

forums.frontier.co.uk

 

[StellarLover]

Hi there! I would love to talk about what I've worked and my passion for animals, and this thread was the beast way to do so, so perfect! I loved animals sice the first book I saw of animals and that passion is still going to this day. After finishing university, I had 1 gole in mind, and that was to try to find as mcuh animals as possible. I soon specialized on one of my favourite animals, mammals. Latley, I've haven't commented on this site, but that's because I've been doing an extensive list of how many mammals I've seen in my life time and the grand total is 6445! I don't know if my list is fully accurate with bats and rodents, but I've been very strict with my list, and if I didn't have any proof for one species, it was excluded from the list. Also taxonomic changes are a pain, but I've managed to live up to the requirements. It's been a long journey, and tho sad, I don't think that I'm up to more adventures. My last one, at 2023, was a 4 month trip to SA and it was exhausting, and since then haven't done much else. But also, I've loved seeing so many magnificent creatures, from swimming with blue whales to holding koalas! But the most precious moment I have is when I met Qiqi, the last known baiji. Obviously, I do hope that baiji aren't extinct, because if I'm correct, there was a sighting back in 20006 or 2007, not sure. Anyway, if anyone has any question or wants to add their personal moments with animals, I'll gladly read and answer them!

 

[Villanelle]

Hi there! I would ove to talk about what I've worked and my passion for animals, and this thread was the beast way to do so, so perfect! I loved animals sice the first bokk I saw of animals I saw and that passion is still going to this day. After finishing university, I had 1 gole in mind and that was to try to find as mcuh animals as possible. I soon specialized on one of my favourite animals, mammals. Latley, I've haven't commented on this site, but that's because I've been doing an extensive list of how many mammals I've seen in my life time and the grand total is 6445! I don't know if my list is fully accurate with bats and rodents, but I've been very strict with my list, and if I didn't have any proof for one species, it was excluded from the list. Also taxonomic changes are a pain, but I've managed to live up to the requirements It's been a long journey, and tho sad, I don't think that I'm up to more adventures. My last one, at 2023, was a 4 month trip to SA and it was exhausting, and since then haven't done much else. But also, I've loved seeing so many magnificent crreatures, from swimming with blue whales to holding koalas! But the most precious moment I have is when I met Qiqi, the last known baiji. Obviously, I do hope that baiji aren't extinct, because if I'm correct, there was a sighting back in 20006 or 2007, not sure. Anyway, if anyone has any question or wants to add their personal moments with animals, I'll gladly read and answer them!

Aw hiya @StellarLover ! Great idea to share your passion in this thread I bet most of us here have had a passion for animals since childhood. All I wanted to do when I was a kid in London was go to the zoo. One day my aunt took me to the Tate Modern instead and apparently I was very unimpressed until I suddenly exclaimed "Seeee! They do have animals in here!" - it was Dali's lobster telephone.

My gosh, it sounds like you've had some absolutely incredible adventures! I can't believe you held a baiji...that's incredible. And swam with blue whales?!!? How? Where? I would love to swim ...uhh...a certain distance from a whale I've seen them from the shore in different places but never been in the water at the same time (to my knowledge!) I am currently obsessed with the AI breakthroughs in communicating with sperm whales so am reading everything whale at the moment.

My top three wildlife adventures have been:
1. 2010 camping trip along the California highway 101, stopping at nature reserves along the coast from Santa Cruz to Santa Barbara. Saw a bobcat, sea otters, sealions, various types of whale and dolphin, eagles, prairie dogs, black and white tailed deer, raccoons, skunks, bats and I don't remember what else. Loved waking up in my tent at Big Sur to be surrounded by about 1000 deer one misty morning. Magical. Went with a boyfriend of the time but we can cut him out of the photo now. Much preferred the company of the animals!

2. 2013 jungle adventure in Borneo. Went with my mum. We did a river safari and stayed at a rainforest lodge, deep in the Borneo rainforest. We saw enormous crocodiles and, in the evening, the trees along the river lit up like christmas trees with fireflies. Unforgettable. Also maroon and silver leaf monkeys, proboscis monkeys, langurs, bearded pigs, flying squirrels, giant squirrels, lots of cool insect and reptiles, water monitors and...best of all... LOTS of orangutans. So many magnificent birds - toucans etc. Also these huge butterflies that are still very present in my mind: I haven't been able to find them online but they were the size of my head, white and floated like paper airplanes.

3. 2023 South African safari. A belated honeymoon with my guy. We stayed at a very carefully controlled safari lodge where day guests are not allowed and no more than 4 jeeps are allowed at any animal sighting. So the animals' privacy is well protected and their stress levels low, and their hunting and reproduction behaviours are not disturbed. I can't even begin to list how many animals we saw but all the big 5 and more importantly for me, lots of the 'little 50' which I was more interested in! Mongoose etc and amazing birds. Seeing lion prides hunting was really cool.

My next wish is to go to Costa Rica - have you been there? Also to visit my friends in Poland, they have wolves and lynx on their land! They're setting up camera traps and have just bought some night vision goggles to go wolf spotting Hoping to go next year sometime.

 

[Villanelle]

Anyway, today I learned that ChatGPT is actually really useful for dumbing-down scholarly articles, so I've been deep-diving into studies about Pleistocene wildlife, which has been fun, and it's convinced me to start a sort of speculative zoology project.

Sounds intriguing! Do tell?

 

[StellarLover]

Aw hiya @StellarLover ! Great idea to share your passion in this thread I bet most of us here have had a passion for animals since childhood. All I wanted to do when I was a kid in London was go to the zoo. One day my aunt took me to the Tate Modern instead and apparently I was very unimpressed until I suddenly exclaimed "Seeee! They do have animals in here!" - it was Dali's lobster telephone.

My gosh, it sounds like you've had some absolutely incredible adventures! I can't believe you held a baiji...that's incredible. And swam with blue whales?!!? How? Where? I would love to swim ...uhh...a certain distance from a whale I've seen them from the shore in different places but never been in the water at the same time (to my knowledge!) I am currently obsessed with the AI breakthroughs in communicating with sperm whales so am reading everything whale at the moment.

My top three wildlife adventures have been:
1. 2010 camping trip along the California highway 101, stopping at nature reserves along the coast from Santa Cruz to Santa Barbara. Saw a bobcat, sea otters, sealions, various types of whale and dolphin, eagles, prairie dogs, black and white tailed deer, raccoons, skunks, bats and I don't remember what else. Loved waking up in my tent at Big Sur to be surrounded by about 1000 deer one misty morning. Magical. Went with a boyfriend of the time but we can cut him out of the photo now. Much preferred the company of the animals!

2. 2013 jungle adventure in Borneo. Went with my mum. We did a river safari and stayed at a rainforest lodge, deep in the Borneo rainforest. We saw enormous crocodiles and, in the evening, the trees along the river lit up like christmas trees with fireflies. Unforgettable. Also maroon and silver leaf monkeys, proboscis monkeys, langurs, bearded pigs, flying squirrels, giant squirrels, lots of cool insect and reptiles and...best of all... LOTS of orangutans. So many magnificent birds - toucans etc. Also these huge butterflies that are still very present in my mind: I haven't been able to find them online but they were the size of my head, white and floated like paper airplanes.

3. 2023 South African safari. A belated honeymoon with my guy. We stayed at a very carefully controlled safari lodge where day guests are not allowed and no more than 4 jeeps are allowed at any animal sighting. So the animals' privacy is well protected and their stress levels low, and their hunting and reproduction behaviours are not disturbed. I can't even begin to list how many animals we saw but all the big 5 and more importantly for me, lots of the 'little 50' which I was more interested in! Mongoose etc and amazing birds. Seeing lion prides hunting was really cool.

My next wish is to go to Costa Rica - have you been there? Also to visit my friends in Poland, they have wolves and lynx on their land! They're setting up camera traps and have just bought some night vision goggles to go wolf spotting Hoping to go next year sometime.

Thanks for the lovely comment @Villanelle! When I swam with the whales it was not as close as I've done with other marine mammals (50-60 feet normally for whales), because it's for my own safety and for the safety of the whales, because you should be at a safe distance when you're working with these type of animals, specially if you have boats! Normally I did my divings at California, the Canary islands and Hawaii, as those are hotspots for cetacean watching, but have done it at so many more places, such as in NZ to watch the incredible Hector's dolphin! And, yes I'be been to Costa Rica to see a hanfull of endemic species there! Overall, your journeys sound magnificent and feel realy nice!

 

[Stygi]

Hi there! I would love to talk about what I've worked and my passion for animals, and this thread was the beast way to do so, so perfect! I loved animals sice the first book I saw of animals and that passion is still going to this day. After finishing university, I had 1 gole in mind, and that was to try to find as mcuh animals as possible. I soon specialized on one of my favourite animals, mammals. Latley, I've haven't commented on this site, but that's because I've been doing an extensive list of how many mammals I've seen in my life time and the grand total is 6445! I don't know if my list is fully accurate with bats and rodents, but I've been very strict with my list, and if I didn't have any proof for one species, it was excluded from the list. Also taxonomic changes are a pain, but I've managed to live up to the requirements. It's been a long journey, and tho sad, I don't think that I'm up to more adventures. My last one, at 2023, was a 4 month trip to SA and it was exhausting, and since then haven't done much else. But also, I've loved seeing so many magnificent crreatures, from swimming with blue whales to holding koalas! But the most precious moment I have is when I met Qiqi, the last known baiji. Obviously, I do hope that baiji aren't extinct, because if I'm correct, there was a sighting back in 20006 or 2007, not sure. Anyway, if anyone has any question or wants to add their personal moments with animals, I'll gladly read and answer them!

Aw hiya @StellarLover ! Great idea to share your passion in this thread I bet most of us here have had a passion for animals since childhood. All I wanted to do when I was a kid in London was go to the zoo. One day my aunt took me to the Tate Modern instead and apparently I was very unimpressed until I suddenly exclaimed "Seeee! They do have animals in here!" - it was Dali's lobster telephone.

My gosh, it sounds like you've had some absolutely incredible adventures! I can't believe you held a baiji...that's incredible. And swam with blue whales?!!? How? Where? I would love to swim ...uhh...a certain distance from a whale I've seen them from the shore in different places but never been in the water at the same time (to my knowledge!) I am currently obsessed with the AI breakthroughs in communicating with sperm whales so am reading everything whale at the moment.

My top three wildlife adventures have been:
1. 2010 camping trip along the California highway 101, stopping at nature reserves along the coast from Santa Cruz to Santa Barbara. Saw a bobcat, sea otters, sealions, various types of whale and dolphin, eagles, prairie dogs, black and white tailed deer, raccoons, skunks, bats and I don't remember what else. Loved waking up in my tent at Big Sur to be surrounded by about 1000 deer one misty morning. Magical. Went with a boyfriend of the time but we can cut him out of the photo now. Much preferred the company of the animals!

2. 2013 jungle adventure in Borneo. Went with my mum. We did a river safari and stayed at a rainforest lodge, deep in the Borneo rainforest. We saw enormous crocodiles and, in the evening, the trees along the river lit up like christmas trees with fireflies. Unforgettable. Also maroon and silver leaf monkeys, proboscis monkeys, langurs, bearded pigs, flying squirrels, giant squirrels, lots of cool insect and reptiles, water monitors and...best of all... LOTS of orangutans. So many magnificent birds - toucans etc. Also these huge butterflies that are still very present in my mind: I haven't been able to find them online but they were the size of my head, white and floated like paper airplanes.

3. 2023 South African safari. A belated honeymoon with my guy. We stayed at a very carefully controlled safari lodge where day guests are not allowed and no more than 4 jeeps are allowed at any animal sighting. So the animals' privacy is well protected and their stress levels low, and their hunting and reproduction behaviours are not disturbed. I can't even begin to list how many animals we saw but all the big 5 and more importantly for me, lots of the 'little 50' which I was more interested in! Mongoose etc and amazing birds. Seeing lion prides hunting was really cool.

My next wish is to go to Costa Rica - have you been there? Also to visit my friends in Poland, they have wolves and lynx on their land! They're setting up camera traps and have just bought some night vision goggles to go wolf spotting Hoping to go next year sometime.

Got some lucky people on this thread! Almost making me feel a little jealous. In my 16 years on this rock so far I have seen around 260 species of mammals and the only real notable wildlife experiences I have are a drive through Jasper national park and whale watching off Iceland. The things you have both done sound awesome hopefully I will get to do something similar one day!

 

[NZFanatic]

Sounds intriguing! Do tell?

It's nothing too intriguing. Just speculating on what species might be called had they never gone extinct and were a part of the human experience in the post-enlightenment era. For example, Homotherium latidens would be a critically endangered felid called the 'sabar' (sounds like 'sabre' but actually comes from a Georgian word meaning 'hunter'). I imagine they could find refuge in the Caucasus Mountains, where there is enough large prey to sustain them (deer, ibex, wild boars, etc).

Smilodon populator becomes the nahual (from a Mapuche word meaning "beast" or some such thing, similarly to how "jaguar" comes from the Guarani language). The doedicurus becomes the armadota (effectively the opposite meaning to armadillo). The word 'mammoth' is never popularised; we get the Siberian and American elephants. A surviving lineage of sivatherium in East Africa becomes the jasiri.

On a more familiar level, leopards could have survived in Europe (particularly Iberia and the Balkans), so we get Panthera pardus thracicus instead of P. p. spelaea (reflecting a living animal, not fossils found in caves). Then there's the Indian giant elephant; Paleoloxodon namadicus, the largest land mammal in existence. Historically some of these beasts rivalled Paraceratherium in size. Imagine visiting a zoo and seeing a bull P. namadicus. It would be gargantuan.

The balang (hook-clawed beast, roughly) is Hesperotherium sinense, the last surviving chalicothere, the weirdest ungulates to ever exist, and similar the yanwang (ape king) is a relic population of Gigantopithecus gigantea.

The project centres around a fictional zoo in a fictional city called Shadley, in Lincolnshire. I'm planning on eventually hand-drawing a zoo map, something I haven't done since I was a kid. I'd like to do it digitally, but I do not know how and do not have time to learn.

 

[NZFanatic]

^ One fun aspect of the above is learning about where species were. Spain/Iberia actually had quite a bit of megafauna at the end of the Pleistocene, including leopards and the narrow-nosed rhinoceros (Stephanorhinus). There's a very old saying that "Africa starts at the Pyrenees", and at the end of the Pleistocene this was kind of true.

 

[Mr-Hyrax 2]

hey guys, how do you guys build past your entrance, I can build entrances and habitats but building the stuff past the entrance, like I know about gift shops and entrance animals but it's pretty much everything else, do y'all have and pics of how you guys build your entrances and your transitions from the entrance to the themed area

 

[Annie_konik]

hey guys, how do you guys build past your entrance, I can build entrances and habitats but building the stuff past the entrance, like I know about gift shops and entrance animals but it's pretty much everything else, do y'all have and pics of how you guys build your entrances and your transitions from the entrance to the themed area

Maybe don't start with building the entrance? Leave it very simple until you know what the rest of the zoo will look like?

I play franchise so I usually build some habitats first and decorate the entrance later because of limited funds at the start. Also it seems easier because the zoo is already running and I can get busy adjusting things and getting ideas about how to integrate it with the rest.

But sometimes I just draw quite detailed plan on paper, get about 50% of it done in the game and then I have to improvise because it looks nothing like my initial plan