A great read for a stormy night with the power out, Rochester, great stuff!
The Quest To Find Raxxla
- Thread starter Macros Black
- Start date
Nice. How big is that sphere?
The milky way
Would you mind listing the systems you currently have that are recoded in the "The Lost Realms" Zone?
Here is the link from the thread:
Post in thread 'The Lost Realms’
https://forums.frontier.co.uk/threads/the-quest-to-find-raxxla.168253/post-10214625
These identify the key locations referenced by Robert Holdstock which I’ve found in game, as well as those with a close contextual association.
That zone technically is within the Underworld zone - because this concept of an ‘Otherworld’ is technically rolled up with the concept of an ‘Underworld’, which is more of a punitive Christian concept than a paradise as with that of an otherworld, but the two are the same in certain cultures.
The Underworld zone is much wider.
Obviously there is an extensive level of stars, so I’m not going to record these separately. I make maps based upon relationships.
Of interest to me is the shapes of these zones. I long thought the Underworld was a dense focal point; it isn’t - it’s more of a level… where as the Lost Realms, certainly is a defined area.
Similarly I found that in the Older god network there is this enclosed sphere of gods linked to Storms… I thought this at first was just a generic ’bubble’ around Sol. But it clearly isn’t and halts at the level of water and the Underworld. And there’s a clear ‘upper zone’ above it…
Again this what I wanted to convey in my last post, as system’s attributed to the potential gates of hell do fall upon this circumstance… which I believe is an example of Brooke replication of Milton’s zone of Chaos in game.
In addition - I have not posted this, because I feel it can’t be substantiated, but if we now accept this underworld level is a little wider, this technically makes sense of Jacques travels outbid the bubble…
Again the above is just an assumption, there is nothing other than spacial relationship associations to draw them together, but patterns do exist and I find these fascinating. For instance here is the same map above but cross referenced with the map of Gilgamesh…the Triads, The Shibboleth and Brookes Tours…
Post in thread 'The Lost Realms’
https://forums.frontier.co.uk/threads/the-quest-to-find-raxxla.168253/post-10214625
These identify the key locations referenced by Robert Holdstock which I’ve found in game, as well as those with a close contextual association.
That zone technically is within the Underworld zone - because this concept of an ‘Otherworld’ is technically rolled up with the concept of an ‘Underworld’, which is more of a punitive Christian concept than a paradise as with that of an otherworld, but the two are the same in certain cultures.
The Underworld zone is much wider.
Obviously there is an extensive level of stars, so I’m not going to record these separately. I make maps based upon relationships.
Of interest to me is the shapes of these zones. I long thought the Underworld was a dense focal point; it isn’t - it’s more of a level… where as the Lost Realms, certainly is a defined area.
Similarly I found that in the Older god network there is this enclosed sphere of gods linked to Storms… I thought this at first was just a generic ’bubble’ around Sol. But it clearly isn’t and halts at the level of water and the Underworld. And there’s a clear ‘upper zone’ above it…
Again this what I wanted to convey in my last post, as system’s attributed to the potential gates of hell do fall upon this circumstance… which I believe is an example of Brooke replication of Milton’s zone of Chaos in game.
In addition - I have not posted this, because I feel it can’t be substantiated, but if we now accept this underworld level is a little wider, this technically makes sense of Jacques travels outbid the bubble…
Again the above is just an assumption, there is nothing other than spacial relationship associations to draw them together, but patterns do exist and I find these fascinating. For instance here is the same map above but cross referenced with the map of Gilgamesh…the Triads, The Shibboleth and Brookes Tours…
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Thanks I will review the post in detail..... and whilst I'm not as well read as your good self in the fictional areas (Milton, Holdstock, etc)...
Would I be right in concluding we should focus on the zones of Chaos, Lost Realms, and the triad goddesses as these zones are the most likely locations for Raxxla based on your theory?
Yes very much so I believe.
Sadly I’m not in game to test anything, presently in middle of a house renovation, so all I can do is mapping.
I think those areas are key. They don’t pin point any specific location (or do they). But Im certain these areas are intentional.
FD inserted only recently the Brookes Tours, the first leg of which takes us right into the Lost Realms zone. I see that as FD throwing us a bone.
That’s either them telling us it’s right there, or there is something around there that ought to highlight the correct path.
Some parts of this are too complex to ever warrant as being an intentional clue, I don’t think FD would ever be so complex, but rather this is an archeological clue towards the architecture that Brookes built for his narrative/s. Understand how the house was built and you can try and understand how people move and live within it…
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Now my brain is buzzing...... not usually a good sign as I now have a million more thoughts to filter
Have you considered the 3 main races in game in relation to Paradise lost and mythology and perhaps how the regions of activity for each map to your model?
e.g.
Humanity - Us - cast from Eden (Raxxla) for breaking the rules - What was lost....?
The Watchers/Olympian gods - Guardians?
Fallen Angels/Satan/Titans - Thargoids?
Guardians / The Watchers / Ancient deities: If the Guardians and ancient deities are figures who are tasked with protecting or guiding humanity. e.g. In Norse mythology, the Aesir and Vanir are groups of deities who are responsible for maintaining order in the world.... or Prometheus in Greek mythology? (Stole fire and gave it to humans... the Guardian tech?)
Thargoids / Fallen angels / Satan / Rebellious gods: Both fallen angels and rebellious gods are figures who have challenged the established order and rebelled against their creator or ruler. In Greek mythology the Titans rebelled against their father, Cronus, and were imprisoned in Tartarus.
Just a thought.... not properly thought out....
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I don't think they map to Rochester's hypothesis at all; the Guardian and Thargoid regions of the ED Milky Way are outside the areas that Rochester seems to be postulating. It seems that MB took aspects of several mythologies and used them to name various systems that are within the ED human bubble. I keep trying (currently without success) to map this hypothesis against this diagram from the Astronomy of Milton's poetry (see Project Gutenberg ebook https://www.gutenberg.org/files/28434/28434-h/28434-h.htm ). I need to see this overlaid to understand how the hypothesis might lead to Raxxla...Now my brain is buzzing...... not usually a good sign as I now have a million more thoughts to filter
Have you considered the 3 main races in game in relation to Paradise lost and mythology and perhaps how the regions of activity for each map to your model?
e.g.
Humanity - Us - cast from Eden (Raxxla) for breaking the rules - What was lost....?
The Watchers/Olympian gods - Guardians?
Fallen Angels/Satan/Titans - Thargoids?
Guardians / The Watchers / Ancient deities: If the Guardians and ancient deities are figures who are tasked with protecting or guiding humanity. e.g. In Norse mythology, the Aesir and Vanir are groups of deities who are responsible for maintaining order in the world.... or Prometheus in Greek mythology? (Stole fire and gave it to humans... the Guardian tech?)
Thargoids / Fallen angels / Satan / Rebellious gods: Both fallen angels and rebellious gods are figures who have challenged the established order and rebelled against their creator or ruler. In Greek mythology the Titans rebelled against their father, Cronus, and were imprisoned in Tartarus.
Just a thought.... not properly thought out....
Attachments
I am very impressed by the analysis of so many mythologies (and the background knowledge required to recognise so many names from different cultures and myths), Rochester! o7
I feel that there is not a lot more that can be done now - these regions you have identified are like a map and the question then becomes 'what is the path?' or 'what system is the end point in?' or even 'do we have to undertake a journey, to find the end point?'
For the moment I want to consider the Shamash incident.
I have been reluctant to think of this as related to Raxxla because there is nothing I have read in the myths or lore associating Raxxla with sudden madness and violence. I'll suppose now that was wrong and consider what it means:
1) FD are actively, yet covertly, pushing the Raxxla storyline. We have had the Brookes Galactic Tours and Shamash all in the space of a few months. They want it to be found!
2) The madness on board the Generation Ship Thetis was so similar to the Shamash incident as to suggest the same cause.
3) The key similarity between the Thetis and Shamash behaviour is that both resulted from listening to an audio signal that was picked up on frequencies used for communications. This indicates the presence of something nearby!
4) An audio signal may be the key to pinning down the location of Raxxla. If it is way off in deep space and does not appear as a location on FSS, then this could be a way to allow it to be found. (I once tried to find the Voyagers in Sol before FSS and even knowing the heading I was not able to get within 1 KLs to have them appear on my contacts list in the left hand panel).
5) The final log of the Thetis contains the audio that caused the incident - perhaps this is something we could look for elsewhere?
There are unanswered questions here, if Raxxla is close to this region. In particular, all the hints pointing towards the Lost Realms region. If those were just to highlight the existence of the 'Mythology Map', then why focus on just one part of it? Also, have there been other hints that we have missed, in Galnet or Tourist Beacons or elsewhere that might highlight other areas, or even define a route? I am also thinking about rare goods and the names of stations, worlds and minor factions. In the Elite- and Founder-restricted Shinrarta Dezhra we have The Waters of Shintara (and note that it is not the Waters of Shinrarta Dezhra)! That is significant, though I don't know if we will need to carry some, perhaps it is suggesting something about the nature of the journey.
My instincts are telling me that there is a journey involved to find Raxxla - that we cannot just jump to the system, fly to its location and experience whatever it is. Maybe it does move, either within its system or from system to system. If the clue to find it is in audio, then to find it more than once (remember that quote!) we might have to follow an audio trail through the Lost Realms, though the starting point would be the same. Maybe that is in/near Shamash.
I could, of course, be completely wrong.
I feel that there is not a lot more that can be done now - these regions you have identified are like a map and the question then becomes 'what is the path?' or 'what system is the end point in?' or even 'do we have to undertake a journey, to find the end point?'
For the moment I want to consider the Shamash incident.
I have been reluctant to think of this as related to Raxxla because there is nothing I have read in the myths or lore associating Raxxla with sudden madness and violence. I'll suppose now that was wrong and consider what it means:
1) FD are actively, yet covertly, pushing the Raxxla storyline. We have had the Brookes Galactic Tours and Shamash all in the space of a few months. They want it to be found!
2) The madness on board the Generation Ship Thetis was so similar to the Shamash incident as to suggest the same cause.
3) The key similarity between the Thetis and Shamash behaviour is that both resulted from listening to an audio signal that was picked up on frequencies used for communications. This indicates the presence of something nearby!
4) An audio signal may be the key to pinning down the location of Raxxla. If it is way off in deep space and does not appear as a location on FSS, then this could be a way to allow it to be found. (I once tried to find the Voyagers in Sol before FSS and even knowing the heading I was not able to get within 1 KLs to have them appear on my contacts list in the left hand panel).
5) The final log of the Thetis contains the audio that caused the incident - perhaps this is something we could look for elsewhere?
There are unanswered questions here, if Raxxla is close to this region. In particular, all the hints pointing towards the Lost Realms region. If those were just to highlight the existence of the 'Mythology Map', then why focus on just one part of it? Also, have there been other hints that we have missed, in Galnet or Tourist Beacons or elsewhere that might highlight other areas, or even define a route? I am also thinking about rare goods and the names of stations, worlds and minor factions. In the Elite- and Founder-restricted Shinrarta Dezhra we have The Waters of Shintara (and note that it is not the Waters of Shinrarta Dezhra)! That is significant, though I don't know if we will need to carry some, perhaps it is suggesting something about the nature of the journey.
My instincts are telling me that there is a journey involved to find Raxxla - that we cannot just jump to the system, fly to its location and experience whatever it is. Maybe it does move, either within its system or from system to system. If the clue to find it is in audio, then to find it more than once (remember that quote!) we might have to follow an audio trail through the Lost Realms, though the starting point would be the same. Maybe that is in/near Shamash.
I could, of course, be completely wrong.
Jaque's trip and possible "bridge" is a bit far from the bubble! ;-)
Very much the case
However I do believe it IS that Miltonian model which has been applied - however it is rather more tiered, like this:
Sometime ago I postulated that the Yggdrasil tree in game was not upon an atypical up/down alignment, but is likewise tiered.
Personally - I try an look at this way… I build GIS maps all day, it’s easy, if I was to try an build this, I would look to replicate this perfectly… However I would be very aware that in game such a huge system would be very easy to identify, Also Brookes very likely was not GIS trained, he did mention he was ‘no academic’ and very likely built all this in spreadsheet…. secondly many of these stories don’t attribute themselves to a clear up/down alignment as shown in this image. So I fell they were tiered.
Don’t get me wrong, I prefer this version, because it marries the science and mathematics Milton outlined in Paradise Lost, but these maps were developed after the fact in an attempt to make sense of his cosmological model…and there was a fair level of abstraction too in Milton, objects were huge and small at the same time, near or far etc… in one sense Milton described Hell as being 3 semi diameters in distance to that of heaven in relation to the size of our globe…which as in the diagram above would advocate our globe occupying at least one third or so of this cosmos, being rather large; then described the golden chain as a golden stair; then he shows our globe as being insignificantly small hanging from the expanse of heaven, with Chaos far below, yet with also Chaos all around too… I don’t feel there is any definitive model.
Miltons text worked at confusing this scale on purpose, not to obfuscate it’s true meaning, but only to convey its enormity.
In game - as you have outlined, I believe Brookes has combined multiple references together, so I feel the other tiered model is what we are seeing.
In regards to the path of Jacques, I’m somewhat only amused by it, I’d like for it to fit, but I doubt it does. There exists subjective insight from various persons who might advocate Brookes had developed a wider narrative on Thargoids, and this path of Jacques was a dropped storyline.. who knows, I just thought it was cool…
Generally I don’t attribute this theory to Thargoid nor Guardians. I see this a architecture Brookes built, it’s a great signature move, and very likely I believe is an Easter egg championing Robert Holdstock.
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Have Unknown Permits been replaced by "Permit is required for this location"?From Wikipedia...
Izanami - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
Izanami
Izanami (イザナミ), formally referred to with the honorific Izanami-no-Mikoto (伊弉冉尊/伊邪那美命, meaning "She-who-invites" or the "Female-who-invites"), is the creator deity of both creation and death in Japanese mythology, as well as the Shinto mother goddess. She and her brother-husband Izanagi are the last of the seven generations of primordial deities that manifested after the formation of heaven and earth. Izanami and Izanagi are held to be the creators of the Japanese archipelago and the progenitors of many deities, which include the sun goddess Amaterasu, the moon deity Tsukuyomi and the storm god Susanoo. In mythology, she is the direct ancestor of the Japanese imperial family.
That sector contains the permit locked (not Unknown Permit!) BLEIA1, BLEIA2, BLEIA3, BLEIA4 and BLEIA5.... so probably for future content as per MB response to locked regions...?
View attachment 377452
That's a big old area.....I wonder what could be out there.....
Just a thought
I guess it's linked to this from Elite Dangerous Wiki....
Guess I can stop these thoughts and trying to find a Wreaken/Something similar permit
(oh well at least I clocked up the Tiliala permit yesterday.... thought Valhalla as a planet was interesting name....)
Just a thought...
Attachments
So I've visited Shamash, scanned, listened to and recorded the voice logs and explored the possibility of locating something via an audio signal in FSS mode (since the Stargoids produced signals detectable from other systems, it seems quite feasible for a system related to Raxxla to generate an audio signal in the same way - maybe that was another hint?).
Here is my video of the voice logs from Shamash:
Also, I made a video of the voice logs of the Generation Ship Thetis:
(The individual logs have been bookmarked). I hope the sound is OK, for some reason it was very quiet for me upon playback but was fine in-game ... .
Regarding the Shamash logs, it seems that there is a voice in the background that sounds as if it has been slowed down. At times it even sounds as if it is reading out letters using the phonetic alphabet. There are also 'screeches' and 'buzzes' that might indicate information that can be revealed in a spectrogram. This kind of analysis is outside my area of expertise but feel free to have a listen and investigate from the above videos.
The Thetis logs do not have this, except for a tiny patch at the end of the third log. I'm not sure what to make of the final log... .
As for the examination of audio in the FSS, I pointed to a few locations, like Sagittarius A*, one of the Thargoid Titans, Artemis, Nefertem, Axis Mundi and Elysia but did not hear anything other than the standard background noise. I did note that by hovering over an in-system signal source that I had not yet identified, I would hear a distinctive audio signal representative of what it was, so long as the FSS was tuned to roughly (it did not need to be exact) the right frequency. I would say that it would be impractical to use this method as a general search tool but if you had a shortlist of systems to check you would be able to identify a signal coming from one of them.
Here is my video of the voice logs from Shamash:
Also, I made a video of the voice logs of the Generation Ship Thetis:
(The individual logs have been bookmarked). I hope the sound is OK, for some reason it was very quiet for me upon playback but was fine in-game ... .
Regarding the Shamash logs, it seems that there is a voice in the background that sounds as if it has been slowed down. At times it even sounds as if it is reading out letters using the phonetic alphabet. There are also 'screeches' and 'buzzes' that might indicate information that can be revealed in a spectrogram. This kind of analysis is outside my area of expertise but feel free to have a listen and investigate from the above videos.
The Thetis logs do not have this, except for a tiny patch at the end of the third log. I'm not sure what to make of the final log... .
As for the examination of audio in the FSS, I pointed to a few locations, like Sagittarius A*, one of the Thargoid Titans, Artemis, Nefertem, Axis Mundi and Elysia but did not hear anything other than the standard background noise. I did note that by hovering over an in-system signal source that I had not yet identified, I would hear a distinctive audio signal representative of what it was, so long as the FSS was tuned to roughly (it did not need to be exact) the right frequency. I would say that it would be impractical to use this method as a general search tool but if you had a shortlist of systems to check you would be able to identify a signal coming from one of them.
Going off this interest with Shamash in the diagram below I’ve shown the Norse Norns, against the Greek Fates. Note how Shamash and Thetis are just above! Very weird.
Then if we add the path of the Shibboleth and Brookes Drabbles, a weird alignment might be seen… travelling through a space relative to Shibboleth and the Brookes Drabbles?
So in my opinion, seeing as this area is also right on the upper rim of the Storm / Chaos zone, I get a feeling its pointing someplace…
Then if we add the path of the Shibboleth and Brookes Drabbles, a weird alignment might be seen… travelling through a space relative to Shibboleth and the Brookes Drabbles?
So in my opinion, seeing as this area is also right on the upper rim of the Storm / Chaos zone, I get a feeling its pointing someplace…
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Yes, but Jacques trip was down in the region of Chaos, not where I'd expect Raxxla /Eden to be from this hypothesis...
Ah, I was thinking wider than that in relation to Guardians/Thargoids
And chaos I was thinking for Thargs and wondering if it covered Col Sector 70 or plaedies...
So I've recorded a video where I've plotted "Underworld" references I could find on the galaxy map, along side plotting a route from Artemis to PMD2009 48 for the Brookes Memorial Tour as reference....
Not an exact science as with any mythology, but tried to find systems with links to the Underworld... feel free to correct me or suggest additions....
Any thoughts?
Source: https://youtu.be/Gz1jhwZkx2A
Not an exact science as with any mythology, but tried to find systems with links to the Underworld... feel free to correct me or suggest additions....
Any thoughts?
| Culture / Reference | System Name |
| Buddhist | Avici |
| Celtic | Ankou |
| Celtic | Cernunnos |
| Chinese | Diyu |
| Egyptian | Amente |
| Egyptian | Anubis |
| Egyptian | Nephthys |
| Egyptian | Osiris |
| Finnish | Tuoni |
| Greek | Erebus |
| Greek | Hecate |
| Greek | Morpheus |
| Greek | Persephone |
| Greek | Styx |
| Greek | Tartarus |
| Greek | Thanatos |
| Hindu | Yama |
| Hindu | Yami |
| Japanese | Izanami |
| Mesopotamian | Irkalla |
| Norse | Hel |
| Norse | Helheim |
| Mesopotamian | Gilgamesh |
| Slavic | Morana |
| Welsh | Annwn |
| Welsh | Caer Siddi |
- Avici: In Buddhism, Avici is the lowest and most painful level of the Naraka (hell) realm.
- Ankou: The Celtic personification of death, who ferries the souls of the dead to the underworld.
- Cernunnos: Cernunnos is a Celtic deity associated with nature, fertility, and the underworld. He is often depicted with antlers and is sometimes considered a psychopomp, guiding souls to the afterlife.
- Diyu: Diyu, also known as the Chinese Hell or the underworld in Chinese mythology and Taoism. It is a complex realm with different levels, where souls are judged and undergo various forms of punishment or reward.
- Amente: Amente, also known as Amentet, is the ancient Egyptian concept of the underworld. It is a realm where the souls of the deceased travel after death and undergo judgment before reaching their final destination.
- Anubis: Anubis is an ancient Egyptian god associated with mummification, the afterlife, and the underworld. He is often depicted as a jackal-headed figure and is responsible for guiding souls through the underworld.
- Nephthys: Nephthys is an ancient Egyptian goddess associated with the afterlife and the underworld. She is often depicted as a mourning woman and is considered a protective deity for the deceased.
- Osiris: Osiris is one of the most important ancient Egyptian gods associated with the afterlife and the underworld. He is the judge of the dead and is responsible for the resurrection and eternal life of the deceased.
- Tuoni: Tuoni is a Finnish mythological figure associated with death and the underworld. In Finnish mythology, Tuonela is the realm of the dead, and Tuoni is the ruler of this realm.
- Erebus: Erebus is a primordial deity in Greek mythology who personifies darkness and shadow. He is often associated with the depths of the earth and the realm of the dead.
- Hecate: The Greek goddess of witchcraft, crossroads, and the underworld, associated with spirits and the souls of the dead.
- Morpheus: The Greek god of dreams and sleep, who rules over the underworld realm of dreams, known as Oneiroi.
- Persephone: Persephone is a Greek goddess associated with the cycle of life, death, and rebirth. She is the daughter of Demeter and is known for spending a portion of the year in the underworld as the wife of Hades.
- Styx: Styx is a river in Greek mythology that forms a boundary between the world of the living and the underworld. It is often portrayed as a river of the dead over which souls must pass.
- Tartarus: Tartarus is a deep abyss in Greek mythology that is used as a prison for the Titans and other ancient enemies of the gods. It is also considered a part of the underworld where divine punishment is administered.
- Thanatos: The Greek god of death, who escorts the souls of the dying to the underworld.
- Yama: The Hindu god of death, the judge of the dead, and the guardian of Naraka, the Hindu underworld.
- Yami: Yami is a Hindu goddess and the sister of Yama. She is associated with death and is considered the ruler of the dead.
- Izanami: Izanami is a goddess in Japanese mythology who, along with her husband Izanagi, created the islands of Japan and gave birth to numerous deities. After her death, she became the ruler of the underworld.
- Irkalla: Irkalla is the Sumerian and Akkadian name for the Mesopotamian underworld. It is ruled by the goddess Ereshkigal and is a dark and gloomy realm where the dead reside.
- Hel: Hel is a Norse goddess associated with the underworld of the same name. She rules over the realm where those who did not die in battle, as well as those who led dishonorable lives, go after death.
- Helheim: Helheim is the realm of the dead in Norse mythology, ruled by the goddess Hel. It is a cold and desolate place where the souls of the dishonorable dead reside.
- Gilgamesh: Gilgamesh is a legendary hero from ancient Mesopotamian mythology. In the epic of Gilgamesh, he embarks on a journey to the underworld in search of immortality.
- Morana: Morana is a Slavic goddess associated with winter, death, and the underworld. She is often depicted as an old woman or a skeletal figure and is believed to bring about the end of the agricultural cycle.
- Annwn: Annwn is the Welsh name for the Otherworld or the realm of the dead in Welsh mythology. It is a mysterious and otherworldly realm associated with deities and spirits.
- Caer Siddi: Caer Siddi is a mystical fortress or castle mentioned in Welsh mythology. It is often associated with the Otherworld and is sometimes considered a gateway to the realm of the dead.
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If we're assuming the Codex is a clue, or many clues, then by rights any other clues should make sense when compared to the Codex - either by adding more context or explanation, or relating to an existing clue so we can see the continuation of the puzzle there.
Raxxla Codex:
Looking at the facts we have - I personally don't see any connection whatsoever, other than the word 'whisper' used to describe a perceived voice in the Thetis signal. The rest is a case of "one weird thing might be linked to another weird thing".
It seems undeniably clear that the Thetis signal is some version of the Shamash signal, and that some 'agent' or 'agents' already knew about it (Skull-mask person), or rapidly moved to vigilante justice. The two systems proximity is odd, as is the Thetis' orientation to Shamash. It's possible Grey Swan was experimenting with the signal, or being experimented on (both very interesting ideas that tie into my theory at the end!).
Yes, the Thetis signal come from an unknown source 1,000 years ago - but that has been in the heart of the bubble for over a thousand years now, and so far we've only seen one 'event' like this occur. Though honestly I feel pretty strongly that next Halloween season we might see another one where we have to put down another 'murder signal' event and maybe learn a little more about it...
The Thetis was launched from earth between 2097 and 2150-ish. So let's assume the Thetis was launched in 2110, it travelled for at most 270 years, that means it picked up the 'murder signal' around the year 2380.
By 2380 Hyperdrive had been in use for almost 300 years, there is active war between the Federation and Empire, human colonies had spread out a lot. Sirius had become a corporate powerhouse and brokered a truce btween the Federation and Empire. You can stretch this for a few decades either way and the answer is the same:
And the Thetis was no more than 53ly from Sol during this time, well within the sphere of FTL expansion: Alioth was discovered in the 2390's, that's 83ly from Sol.
The Thetis signal was almost certainly a human-made signal (or a human made rogue AI). There would have been human colonies out there, undoubtedly black-ops military scouts, Federation-Imperial special ops teams unofficially duking it out, probably military research projects on distant worlds to keep them secret, etc. etc.
Think about it: a 'murder signal' that infects any comms system and sends anyone who hears it even for a few seconds into a murderous state. That's definitely a weapon. For all we know the Thetis was deliberately targeted by whoever made the weapon, a 'lost' generation ship with thousands of people aboard is a perfect test-lab. I wouldn't be surprised if the unfolding Halloween event story is about how someone rediscovered the old research and tested it out on Grey Swan.
Let's look at Shamash/Thetis for Raxxla clues:
Thetis:- The Thetis picked up a "digital signal...originates from an uninhabited planet we passed 15 light years ago", clearly stated.
- The signal is describes as: "It’s the same message relayed again and again and again – it’s more a whisper than anything else; it says, ‘kill them all’…"
- Thetis is current 53ly from Sol, and we know it was travelling long enough for 8 generations (just started on 9) to be born, using standard calculation of Generations that's between 220 and 270 years, give or take. That's 1ly per 5 years of travel, approximately, we don't know if they stopped at all along the way, but that seems about right for an advanced gen ship.
- Edit: Recall that "uninhabited planet 15ly ago" translates to "it was uninhabited 75 years ago".
- Thetis is stopped in Nefertum around planet 6. We don't know if that's an astronomically lucky thing, or it stopped there automatically/intentionally, or one of the survivors stopped the ship deliberately. It's not a system that seems desirable for a new colony.. who knows!
- One pilot/squad from the military unit "Grey Swan" on exercises picked up a 'murder signal' which caused them to want to kill others.
- The signal "seems to bury itself in the comms network, generating its own feedback loop to maintain broadcast".
- There's a mysterious armoured person in a 'skull mask' helping people survive attacks at Garrett Orbital by killing those infected by the signal. (This was also the outfit rewarded for the CG.)
- Those infected seem to remain 'normal' for some time after infection, something like 20-30mins at least.
- The audio from Shamash contains a message in the spectrogram with the words "Kill them for me"
- Shamash is 15.5ly from Nefertem (The Thetis).
- If you chart Sol (the origin point of Thetis), and Shamash and Nefertem you can clearly see they don't align. Unless the Thetis changed course dramatically, it never passed Shamash.
Raxxla Codex:
- The only indication of an audio presence in the Codex is "whisperer in witch-space", which is exceptionally specific - witch-space, and whisper.
- If you wanted you could compare this line "the legend exerts a strangely potent fascination on the minds of seekers." to the Thetis/Shamash signal's effects on humans, but it's clearly not intended to be read that way, and it's a very different effect even if you read it as a physical 'infection'
Conclusions:
Is Shamash/Thetis in any way similar to any part of the Raxxla legend or the Codex?Looking at the facts we have - I personally don't see any connection whatsoever, other than the word 'whisper' used to describe a perceived voice in the Thetis signal. The rest is a case of "one weird thing might be linked to another weird thing".
It seems undeniably clear that the Thetis signal is some version of the Shamash signal, and that some 'agent' or 'agents' already knew about it (Skull-mask person), or rapidly moved to vigilante justice. The two systems proximity is odd, as is the Thetis' orientation to Shamash. It's possible Grey Swan was experimenting with the signal, or being experimented on (both very interesting ideas that tie into my theory at the end!).
Yes, the Thetis signal come from an unknown source 1,000 years ago - but that has been in the heart of the bubble for over a thousand years now, and so far we've only seen one 'event' like this occur. Though honestly I feel pretty strongly that next Halloween season we might see another one where we have to put down another 'murder signal' event and maybe learn a little more about it...
What might Thetis have picked up then?
I think there's an easy answer that many overlook:The Thetis was launched from earth between 2097 and 2150-ish. So let's assume the Thetis was launched in 2110, it travelled for at most 270 years, that means it picked up the 'murder signal' around the year 2380.
By 2380 Hyperdrive had been in use for almost 300 years, there is active war between the Federation and Empire, human colonies had spread out a lot. Sirius had become a corporate powerhouse and brokered a truce btween the Federation and Empire. You can stretch this for a few decades either way and the answer is the same:
And the Thetis was no more than 53ly from Sol during this time, well within the sphere of FTL expansion: Alioth was discovered in the 2390's, that's 83ly from Sol.
The Thetis signal was almost certainly a human-made signal (or a human made rogue AI). There would have been human colonies out there, undoubtedly black-ops military scouts, Federation-Imperial special ops teams unofficially duking it out, probably military research projects on distant worlds to keep them secret, etc. etc.
Think about it: a 'murder signal' that infects any comms system and sends anyone who hears it even for a few seconds into a murderous state. That's definitely a weapon. For all we know the Thetis was deliberately targeted by whoever made the weapon, a 'lost' generation ship with thousands of people aboard is a perfect test-lab. I wouldn't be surprised if the unfolding Halloween event story is about how someone rediscovered the old research and tested it out on Grey Swan.
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cool, I'll stop by and take a look around both systems for a while, jump between em a few times, Supercruse for a while between them just too look for things that may be far out like the voyager probes in Sol...Well I'm pretty sure this is not going to pay off, so only go there if you're sanguine about that
The exact location is where the circle is here in the "Newton's Vault" region:
View attachment 377325
The two nearest systems are: BYOI AUSCS BA-P D6-7 and BYOI AUSCS JR-A C15-0
If you were to go to one, and look towards the other, I think the sight-line would pass relatively close to the coordinates 23114, 584, 46931.
I've no idea how hard it is to get there, stars look pretty sparse out there.
I didn't quite make it out to Beagle Point just yet, I'll be there this week still, but just got home from out of town all weekend so not sure if I'll get any playing in tonight.... but yeah, I'll be headed here afterwards, lol, got nothing better to do after except stop by Sag A*, and maybe the supposed area for the landscape signal, but those are not a priority of any kind...