The Quest To Find Raxxla

[Louis Calvert]

A comparison of 'Elite: The Dark Wheel, by Robert Holdstock' with in-game Lore.​

Presented here is my own comparisons. I like to go and check these things myself, so this will have been done before, if there are similarities then that's good
I put this together because of Allen's comment here, got me thinking about the Codex "Princess Astrophel..." line, I always assumed that was a warning to steer away from TDW novella, so I thought I'd check the source text. I was honestly very surprised - especially with further matches to the Codex.

Note: In the following quotes I've coloured words/lines that are an exact, close or very similar match.
"TDW 194" means 'Elite: The Dark Wheel, by Robert Holdstock'

---

Spoiler: Faraway Jump

TDW 1984​

"Faraway is a tunnel, like any other tunnel. Inside that tunnel is the realm called Witch-Space, a magic place, a place where the normal rules of the Universe don't necessarily work. And every few thousand parsecs along the Witch-Space tunnel there are monitoring satellites, and branch lines, and stop points, and rescue stations."

Galnet 3303 Hyperspace​

"The first commercially available hyperspace system was known as the 'Faraway Jump'. The Faraway system was far from perfect, however, depending on a complex network of monitoring satellites, branch lines, stop points and rescue stations – which took hundreds of years to establish – to operate smoothly."
"... the strange 'corridor' a ship travelled through during a hyperspace jump ..."

Spoiler: Witch-Space, tunnel

TDW 1984​

"In fact, the entry to Witch-Space was accompanied by an almost negligible accelerative surge, a moment's dizziness, and then the spectacular sight of the stars brightening, spreading out and suddenly streaking in multi-coloured circular patterns, so that the ship seemed to be passing down a spinning tube. Almost as soon as the surge of acceleration had come it had gone."

Galnet 3303 Hyperspace​

"It was around this time the phrase 'witch-space' first appeared, reflecting the inherent dangers of early hyperspace technology and the strange 'corridor' a ship travelled through during a hyperspace jump.

Spoiler: Witch-Space Ghosts

TDW 1984​

"They say that Witch-Space is haunted. ... there are ghosts there. The ghosts of the early ships that went in to Faraway, and didn't come out again."

Galnet 3303 Hyperspace​

"Some even believed witch-space was haunted by 'ghosts of ships that went into Faraway and didn't come out again'. It is certainly true that a number of ships never reached their destinations."

HAWKIN’S GAP ALPHA MISSION 4/4​

Expedition Log: 13/10/3270
“Still, it could be worse! I could have pulled the Formidine Rift gig. Rumour is they’re having to double up on ships for that one as the crews are going void-mad and ejecting themselves into space because they’ve seen ghosts. Word is there’s something out there.”

Spoiler: "Things" in Witch-Space

TDW 1984​

"The ship drifted in 'Witch Light', in the non-place in space and time. It was crossing the void between stars in seconds, but for those seconds it was in a twilight world whose existence was beyond imagination"

"Maybe that's why they call it 'witch'. Time turns all around, and atoms turn inside out, and gravity waves billow up, and things move there, lifeforms, or shadows, or atoms, or galaxies, who knows? No-one has ever stopped and gone outside to find out. Only robot remotes exist there, switching stations, monitors, rescue Droids and the like. Whatever lives in Witch-Space, in the Faraway tunnels, will remain a mystery always."

Galnet 3303 Hyperspace​

"Even today, hyperspace remains poorly understood. Many pilots have reported glimpsing inexplicable lights, and even structures, within the witch-space tunnels. It may be centuries before all of its mysteries are unravelled."

FORMIDINE RIFT ALPHA MISSION 2/6​

"Expedition Log: 28/08/3270
Could have sworn I heard some weird voices in the last jump. "

FORMIDINE RIFT ALPHA MISSION 5/6​

"Expedition Log: 07/10/3270
“I can’t bear another jump. The lights in witch-space are coming for me, the lights… always the lights… they’re calling to me… a siren song… I must join them…”"

FORMIDINE RIFT GAMMA MISSION 4/6​

Expedition Log: 01/10/3270
“We’re seeing some strange lights during hyperspace transits. Terror? Yeah, we got some of that…”

FORMIDINE RIFT GAMMA MISSION 5/6​

Expedition Log: 11/11/3270
“More strange lights. We’ve got equipment malfunctions, scanners dropping in and out, systems resetting. Ship is limping on.”

Spoiler: Transit Times

TDW 1984​

"It was crossing the void between stars in seconds, but for those seconds it was in a twilight world whose existence was beyond imagination."

Galnet 3303 Hyperspace​

"... Jump times were reduced to mere seconds, as they had been with quirium drives"

Spoiler: Hyperspace Mis-Jumps

TDW 1984​

"Jump on your own through hyperspace, across more than half a light year, and you'll be lucky to make the same Universe, let alone your destination. You might emerge from Witch-Space turned inside out (which is not a pretty sight)."

"You might be stretched in all the wrong angles, and although the ship keeps travelling, that jelly mass of broken bone and flesh inside the cabin is you."

Michael Brookes Interview​

"Obvious there were a few crazy people that were happy to jump in and make a jump but they tended to disappear or there would be some unknown accident or some trace of them would be found, so it's like with any technology, when you're at the forefront of it there's a bit of risk involved, especially if you're trying to translate across lightyears of space."

Effie Ratling, Engineer, Almeida Landing.​

"I’ve finally made some progress with the drive technology ... The ship didn’t reappear for almost an hour. When it did, it just drifted lifelessly. The pilot didn’t respond to our hails. ... We recovered the vessel and pulled open the cockpit. What I saw in there will stay with me for the rest of my life. The pilot looked like he’d been turned inside out. "

Spoiler: Raxxla is a real place

TDW 1984​

"'Raxxla's no alien, Alex. It's a ghost world. A planet. A legend ... Your father was chasing the mythical plant Raxxla. ... he'd found evidence for the real existence of Raxxla"

Codex: Raxxla​

"The earliest documented stories tend to agree on several points, however: that Raxxla is a definite place, and that it holds a mystical secret."

Spoiler: Raxxla alien construct

TDW 1984​

"on Raxxla there's an alien construct that's a gateway to other Universes"

Codex: Raxxla​

"Several versions of the Raxxla story mention an alien artefact, the Omphalos Rift, described as a gateway or tunnel through which parallel universes can be accessed."

Spoiler: Raxxla Already Discovered

TDW 1984​

"Because there are people on Raxxla already. This is only a guess, mind you, but from what happened to Jason I'd say it was close to being right. We've long suspected that a corps of Eites lives there, and are exploiting the gateway. They're powerful, twisted men. Powerful enough to hire an assassin to kill the threat to their dominance"

Codex: Raxxla​

"Raxxla also plays a role in several conspiracy theories, most of which attest that it has already been discovered by some kind of sinister cabal (or sole tyrant), which has leveraged its power to establish covert dominance over humanity."

Spoiler: Dark Wheel quest for Raxxla

TDW 1984​

"Jason Ryder was convinced that Raxxla existed. That's why he trained for, and became a part of, the Dark Wheel, the legend-seekers. ... The Dark Wheel was a semi-legendary space unit, star-riders who made it their business to seek the truth behind the plethora of myths and romantic stories that filtered back from all corners of the Universe: fabulous cities, parallel worlds, time travellers, even planets that appeared to be the old 'heaven' of Earth legend. The Dark Wheel was as mysterious and as mythical to the traders of the Galaxy as King Arthur might have been to the first spacemen."

Codex: Raxxla​

"The quest for this mysterious place, the location of which is a deadly secret, was said to be the principal aim of the Dark Wheel, a putative fraternity of legend-chasers from the early days of interstellar travel."

Codex: Dark Wheel​

"The Dark Wheel is the name given to a legendary group of adventurers, explorers, investigators and treasure-hunters, the existence of which is so lacking in corroborative evidence that it is generally considered a myth. The group is often mentioned in connection with the equally unsubstantiated 'Raxxla'."

Spoiler: Members training their children

TDW 1984​

'I'm doing it for Jason,' Rafe said. 'And for others besides. And listen Alex. Don't you go worrying about Raxxla. Not yet. That comes in time . . .' 'But why did he say it?' 'To let me know he trusted you. Your father reckoned you have it in you to become one of the Elite. That's good enough for me.'

... "Unless you get there, unless you become Elite, you'll never get to Raxxla. And you'll never know exactly what your father was searching for.'
'I don't understand.' 'Were you aware of his involvement in The Dark Wheel?' ... 'It's not possible,' Alex breathed. 'He would have told us . . .'

'The hell he would,' Rafe said, staring at the younger man from the shimmering holoFac on the bridge. 'The ship that killed Jason was no pirate. He was killed because he'd found something. Something that certain parties were deeply unhappy that he'd found.'

... 'Right. If that's what my father wanted, then I shan't disappoint him . . .'"

"He was right. You are the man to follow him.' 'Follow him where?'

Rafe chuckled and shook his head. 'You see, that's the big question. Your father was chasing the mythical plant Raxxla. Does it exist, or does it not? If it does, then on Raxxla there's an alien construct that's a gateway to other Universes, and all that's in those Universes in the way of bounty, and treasures, and aliens, and life . . ."

Codex: Dark Wheel​

"new members are selected on the basis of lineage, with existing members covertly training their children and revealing the fact of their membership only when the child is ready."

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Conclusion:
While I would be extremely cautious mining the works of Holdstock for clues, it certainly seems apparent that the lore around Raxxla, The Dark Wheel, and Hyperspace is dervied - at least in part - from "Elite: The Dark Wheel, by Robert Holdstock". I am surprised by the use of like-for-like lines in many cases.

 

[Yuki Estelle]

Good analysis, but like everything here it’s open to speculation.

There are various sources (some very recent) in this thread that have ruled out various fictional books, such as those produced by ED approved authors in so much that FD told them directly to not involve Raxxla so one could rule those out?

However that doesn’t rule them out exclusively because FD could have appropriated some of them, cherry picking elements for their own narrative, but it’s an unknown and in my opinion highly unlikely.

We know from the lore guide author Allen Stroud, that although CEO David Braben was not concerned with the work of Holdstock, the original Producer Michael Brookes and lore guide author Stroud were, so at most we can presume some context has had an influence, how much is an unknown.

Some of us suspect FD changed the original DW / Raxxla storyline circa 2016/2017 and in my opinion some, if not all of the historical statements made by FD may now be totally irrelevant, archived or re-purposed; this potentially limits our source material to only the Codex.

At most, we can presume the codex is the primary source information from which we can start, all other information sources (like you have pointed out) are in my opinion viable if they correlate,

The codexes in my opinion potentially identify a number of concepts:

The old DW missions/invite are archived (proven true).
The DW station may be in game, location is unknown.
Tau Ceti is relevant.
2296 is relevant.
The Omphalos mythology is relevant.

Hypothetically the DW codex might be applicable to Raxxla if the station is found, but it’s possible it’s just an Easter egg, at present it’s an unknown.

Tau Ceti and the 2296 are interesting because they do draw an area of influence around Sol. Your data concerning various stars needs in my opinion to correlate to this area.

Question: do they triangulate, does their presence draw a shape, do they encircle an area, are they concentrated (hotspot) in a certain sector of the area of influence?

This area of influence is drawn from simple logic, but also practical temporal mapping practices. This area also correlates to other ‘arcane’ elements, found in game, indicating a strong possibility this area is intentional.

The Omphalos element if viewed simplistically, points us to the system of Delphi and the Pleiades. Again how do the systems you identify correlate to this area, or the area between Delphi and Sol?

If viewed in more depth the Omphalos element could draw us to Sol strengthening that theory, however seeing as some of the ‘arcane’ theories are not promoted in game directly, the simplest solution is that Delphi is the intended location.

How do your locations correlate with both? Do they strengthen one over the other, do they identify another area?

It’s possible the codex holds spurious information, or some information has been attributed greater meaning than was intended by FD, or that said meaning is intentional but actually relates to another thing entirely!

At most I think it’s safe to speculate but we must try and focus on the known facts outlined above (speculative) and look at how they attribute meaning or build relationships with our assumptions to potentially fill in the huge intelligence gaps.

We must also I’m afraid keep with us a healthy dose of scepticism, as FD may have applied narrative gates or that the solution is far simpler that we project, or even partially resolved.

This response was similar in spirit to what I was going to post.

This has been the Achilles' Heel of the entire Raxxla hunt; we just don't know how shallow or deep anything is. When boiled to an essence we are essentially left with two facts:

1. Raxxla exists.
2. It's somewhere in the galaxy.

Unfortunately this sort of non-descript teasing isn't uncommon. Having played ED for all but one of it's years in existence, nebulus (no pun intended) babblecraft and a distinct lack of acknowledgement is FDev's bread and butter. I've always said that a simple confirmation statement would go a long way to encouraging the community, as most of us are burned out and diving into rabbit holes that probably mean nothing. Is this a puzzle? Does it hold relevance? Should we look into it? Find out in the next few years.

Which brings me to the point I want to make: FDev enjoys a good puzzle, but they won't force you to be a rocket scientist. As with most statements made here this is pure supposition, but even the trend for large-scale plots, puzzles and key story elements are accessible to anyone with time and a small amount of Googling.

At the risk of being wrong and looking like a fool, I would like to use the current Stargoid situation as a springboard for this example. Recently we received an FSS upgrade that allows us to listen to Rogue Signals, along with an obvious puzzle hook in the form of a Pilots' Federation Alert. Many of us at Canonn (specifically at the Signals Lab) have been analyzing these signals for hidden messages or codes, which we are fairly certain exist. The experiments are rigorous and include crazy stuff (like plotting a 3D Spectrogram), but nobody expects the solution to require an audio engineering degree because it would defeat the inclusiveness of the puzzle. This helps us to keep our tangents in check and inform our decisions going forward, which has ultimately allowed us to make presumptions like the one I'm about to make: If the signals are indeed a puzzle, the solution will involve a commonly known cryptography solution or the utilization of information we have yet to use properly, such as another signal sound previously introduced. Alternatively, it's not a puzzle and we simply don't have all the information.

This same logical thought process can be applied to most of FDev's decisions pertaining to puzzles, but frequently echoes true in their storytelling style: Something happens, the clues are there but you need more information, you find out the information and start putting together the puzzle, then expectations are subverted. Toss in enough misdirection to throw people a curveball and you have a recipe for the wild west of narratives.

For that reason, I think Raxxla will ultimately be difficult to find but not in the way most of us suspect. I think Greek mythology, astronomy/astrology, mathematics and particularly story hooks will be relevant. It's entirely possible that Raxxla is gated behind system locks or story progression. It's even possible that Raxxla itself doesn't exist in the traditional terms we associate to existence, but I sincerely doubt any of the tin-foil theories we explore here will bear fruit. This doesn't mean we shouldn't explore them, but I think everyone should apply a small amount of tempering to their expectations when it comes to hunting for Raxxla. Stepping too far from a logical path may lead us astray when we ultimately need a narrower heading.

As for my tinfoil comment of the day, I've been optimistic that a subspace galaxy exists within the one we can visually observe. "Witchspace" is a place know scarce little about and I'm sure it hides secrets that could shed light on many of our questions, including Raxxla.

 

[Louis Calvert]

As for my tinfoil comment of the day, I've been optimistic that a subspace galaxy exists within the one we can visually observe. "Witchspace" is a place know scarce little about and I'm sure it hides secrets that could shed light on many of our questions, including Raxxla.

YES! I'm working on this too, can we compare notes?

 

[Louis Calvert]

The Mimas Conspiracy, part 3.​

As promised, here's all my convos with CS regarding Mimas, Saturn and it's moons. I will be posting my investigations into Saturn later on but you can see some of them are here in my email to CS. Make of this what you will Raxxla Hunters!

NOTE: I think this well is dry, I don't think bugging CS with more questions about Saturn will get anywhere. I'm certainly going to give them a rest for a while.

---

TLDR:
Q: Why is Mimas Missing?
A: "This particular case would be an intentional design decision"

Q: Mimas' exclusion has no deeper significance than an arbitrary design decision?
A: "I'm afraid we have no further information beyond that already provided in regards to Mimas not being included by intentional design."

Q: Points out other things that mismatch betwen IRL Saturn & moons, and in-game
A: "We cannot comment on specific design decisions for Saturn's moons any further than we already have. We appreciate your enthusiasm, but this is not something we can elaborate any further on."

Q: Why can't you comment on them?
A: "We have already told you all the information we have about Saturns moons, and there is nothing further we can elaborate on."

Spoiler: Questions to CS re: Mimas and Saturn

Note: Didn't save my original request form - I asked about Mimas, showed them the EDDB link showing mimas. Asked if it was a bug.

---

Again, mad respect to CS for putting up with me that long.

 

[Rochester]

The Mimas Conspiracy, part 3.​

As promised, here's all my convos with CS regarding Mimas, Saturn and it's moons. I will be posting my investigations into Saturn later on but you can see some of them are here in my email to CS. Make of this what you will Raxxla Hunters!

NOTE: I think this well is dry, I don't think bugging CS with more questions about Saturn will get anywhere. I'm certainly going to give them a rest for a while.

---

TLDR:
Q: Why is Mimas Missing?
A: "This particular case would be an intentional design decision"

Q: Mimas' exclusion has no deeper significance than an arbitrary design decision?
A: "I'm afraid we have no further information beyond that already provided in regards to Mimas not being included by intentional design."

Q: Points out other things that mismatch betwen IRL Saturn & moons, and in-game
A: "We cannot comment on specific design decisions for Saturn's moons any further than we already have. We appreciate your enthusiasm, but this is not something we can elaborate any further on."

Q: Why can't you comment on them?
A: "We have already told you all the information we have about Saturns moons, and there is nothing further we can elaborate on."

Spoiler: Questions to CS re: Mimas and Saturn

Note: Didn't save my original request form - I asked about Mimas, showed them the EDDB link showing mimas. Asked if it was a bug.
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Again, mad respect to CS for putting up with me that long.

So in the words of FD ‘it didn’t make the cut’.

So my interpretation is; it’s left out (as are other things) due to economical reasons, eg not enough time/resources to replicate a 100% accurate model.

This I feel matches the actual description of ED, many (not myself) hold to it to be a scientific endeavour, it in my opinion it is not, it is a simulation that utilises abstraction to build a complex fictional model.

There are many iterations were RL data is replicated in game but is wholly in error.

I don’t see this as a flaw, just evidence of design decisions based on practicality. Eg I think M Brookes was responsible for inputting star locations, I take it as red without any insight that he was not an astronomer nor a GIS mapping analysts, so anomalous data is expected,

It didn’t make the cut, for me personally that would indicate it’s just a bug / flaw.

Eg I am an astronomer so know of various ‘famous’ systems, these are not in game, some have culturally significance, even to the linguistic terms FD use in their game, but they are not in game, simply because FD did not use a certain star catalog, and they lacked the resources to plot it manually, which in hindsight would be a continuous endeavour, and we know FD do not operate like that…

 

[Louis Calvert]

Maybe! I think it's incredibly vague and disappointing tbh. Notice they wouldn't actually say "it's not significant", they dodged that question with a blanket "no comment".

Edit:

They can't confirm it's significant, understandably, that would be cheating.
However, imo they can confirm whether it's not significant because there's 400bn stars in the galaxy and limitless other options.
The fact they wouldn't confirm it's not signficant is susy imo.
But then, if they could confirm insignificance to the quest then we would eventually whittle down the options
So... maybe they never reply straight to any question.
= incredibly frustrating.

I would pay a billion credits to just ask an Earth historian about the Sol system over the last 1000 years. The fact we can't do that is irritating.

 

[Rochester]

They did. But I think ‘it didn’t make the cut’ is an answer.

I do find it odd, due to the naming evidence in game, the cultural significance both in history, science and popular culture. Very, very odd.

But maybe on day 1 they couldn’t put it in due to resources, and it was too small because potatoes weren’t put in game until much later.

Then after as stuff was added it was left off simply because of complacency / ignorance. But I suspect it’s just not worth their time?

Agreed it needs rest, look for other things in game which relate to it, then approach from another angle, look for a contradiction - then throw it back at them.

Remember, when I began asking about the DW missions and permits I was actually told several times, working as intended… I then approached it from another perspective and boom they contradicted themselves, I gave them their own statements and they had to give a logical answer.

It’s worth putting a pin in this and looking at it later

 

[Rochester]

Maybe! I think it's incredibly vague and disappointing tbh. Notice they wouldn't actually say "it's not significant", they dodged that question with a blanket "no comment".

Edit:

They can't confirm it's significant, understandably, that would be cheating.
However, imo they can confirm whether it's not significant because there's 400bn stars in the galaxy and limitless other options.
The fact they wouldn't confirm it's not signficant is susy imo.
But then, if they could confirm insignificance to the quest then we would eventually whittle down the options
So... maybe they never reply straight to any question.
= incredibly frustrating.

I would pay a billion credits to just ask an Earth historian about the Sol system over the last 1000 years. The fact we can't do that is irritating.

Nice O7

 

[Louis Calvert]

They did. But I think ‘it didn’t make the cut’ is an answer.

I do find it odd, due to the naming evidence in game, the cultural significance both in history, science and popular culture. Very, very odd.

But maybe on day 1 they couldn’t put it in due to resources, and it was too small because potatoes weren’t put in game until much later.

Then after as stuff was added it was left off simply because of complacency / ignorance. But I suspect it’s just not worth their time?

Agreed it needs rest, look for other things in game which relate to it, then approach from another angle, look for a contradiction - then throw it back at them.

Remember, when I began asking about the DW missions and permits I was actually told several times, working as intended… I then approached it from another perspective and boom they contradicted themselves, I gave them their own statements and they had to give a logical answer.

It’s worth putting a pin in this and looking at it later

Yep good advice. I have a ton of other stuff, I'm just working on the best way to upload a sound clip so you can all hear it and let me know what you think, any ideas?

 

[Rochester]

*redacted.

Error due to connectivity near the galactic core…

 

[Suhurrat]

Good analysis, but like everything here it’s open to speculation.

There are various sources (some very recent) in this thread that have ruled out various fictional books, such as those produced by ED approved authors in so much that FD told them directly to not involve Raxxla so one could rule those out?

However that doesn’t rule them out exclusively because FD could have appropriated some of them, cherry picking elements for their own narrative, but it’s an unknown and in my opinion highly unlikely.

We know from the lore guide author Allen Stroud, that although CEO David Braben was not concerned with the work of Holdstock, the original Producer Michael Brookes and lore guid author Stroud were, so at most we can presume some context has had an influence, how much is an unknown.

Some of us suspect FD changed the original DW / Raxxla storyline circa 2016/2017 and in my opinion some, if not all of the historical statements made by FD may now be totally irrelevant, archived or re-purposed; this potentially limits our source material to only the Codex.

At most, we can presume the codex is the primary source information from which we can start, all other information sources (like you have pointed out) are in my opinion viable if they correlate,

The codexes in my opinion potentially identify a number of concepts:

The old DW missions/invite are archived (proven true).
The DW station may be in game, location is unknown.
Tau Ceti is relevant.
2296 is relevant.
The Omphalos mythology is relevant.

Hypothetically the DW codex might be applicable to Raxxla if the station is found, but it’s possible it’s just an Easter egg, at present it’s an unknown.

Tau Ceti and the 2296 are interesting because they do draw an area of influence around Sol. Your data concerning various stars needs in my opinion to correlate to this area.

Question: do they triangulate, does their presence draw a shape, do they encircle an area, are they concentrated (hotspot) in a certain sector of the area of influence?

This area of influence is drawn from simple logic, but also practical temporal mapping practices. This area also correlates to other ‘arcane’ elements, indicating a strong possibility this area is intentional.

The Omphalos element if viewed simplistically, points us to the system of Delphi snd the Pleiades. Again how do the systems you identify correlate to this area, or the area between Delphi and Sol?

The correlation is very interesting.
Personally, I started from the Alien World book by gradually applying the data we already know from the game itself.

As I pointed out above, almost all events are somehow related to the gaming lore that is now closed to a bubble. All books from the DW as well as information sends us from Tau Ceti to the left side out of bubble. And we have Alien world. If we imagine for a second that the book has at least something to do with the game. Then, according to the descriptions, it can be understood that events occur plus or minus on the right side of the bubble.

99% of the titles in the book are somehow connected with Egyptian mythology. And if we look for stars or systems related to Egyptian mythology, then we will get a whole heap around the bubble +- in the bubble itself.

Since it is impossible to lay an exact path, you can rely only on an approximate region. If we compare the anagrams of the names of Egyptian deities and the history of astronomy, then in principle it is clear that Egyptian astronomy was: much earlier than Greek. However, the Greek one formed the basis of the modern one. Also, let's not forget that all astronomy is based on observation from the earth. And this means that there is a constant displacement.

Here is my best skills in paint.

So if we back to Greek Mythology, omphalos of delphi and all of this stuff.

Again. It's just my theory. Well, or I've already earned space madness. =)

The fact that people are hooked on Greek mythology is understandable. But a lot of people clung to the stellar component. I'm looking more at interpretations. For example Omphalos Rift. We know that Omphalos is a stone according to the myths.

However, the myth itself consists of several parts.

The first part is about Zeus: the god Zeus, in his attempt to locate the center of the earth, launched two eagles from the two ends of the world, and the eagles, starting simultaneously and flying at equal speed, crossed their paths above the area of Delphi, and so was the place where Zeus placed the stone.[1] Since then, Delphi has been considered by Greeks to be the center of the world, the omphalos – "navel of the Earth."

There is also a myth about the god Kronos (Egypt) aka Chronus (Greece).

Cronus learned from Gaia and Uranus that he was destined to be overcome by his own children, just as he had overthrown his father. As a result, although he sired the gods Demeter, Hestia, Hera, Hades, and Poseidon by Rhea, he devoured them all as soon as they were born to prevent the prophecy. When the sixth child, Zeus, was born, Rhea sought Gaia to devise a plan to save them and to eventually get retribution on Cronus for his acts against his father and children.

Rhea secretly gave birth to Zeus in Crete, and handed Cronus a stone wrapped in swaddling clothes, also known as the Omphalos Stone, which he promptly swallowed, thinking that it was his son.

Omphalos stone looks a lot like thargoid sensors and probes. And FSD looks a lot like thargoid sensor. Dont forget that Sirius Corp the creators of FSD, as we know according to the already modern lore of the game, are well versed in alien technologies and sculpt anything based on them.

And as we know from these stories, one stone was given to Chronus, the second stone rests in Delphi. So...Delphi Pleiades Sector. A very active place for the events taking place. And we have Chronus. Because there is no Chronus sys. in elite, we have another name of Chronus - Geb from egypt myth.

Yeah we have Geb system.

Everyone rested on the fact that Omphalos Rift is a kind of artifact somewhere on the planet. But it seems to me that this is just the name of the effect. Not an object. The meanings of the word rift are gap, breach, split, crack.

Which leads me personally to the idea that Omphalos Rift - it is necessary to read as it is. Omphalos Rift - Breach - Gap - Split - Crack.

What can cause gaps in space? FTL and FSD engines

If we build theories further: let's pull the toast of the wheel by the ears. (insert meme about here we go again)

To the jewel that burns on the brow of the mother of galaxies.

Many believe that this is due to Cassiopeia based on Greek myths. I believe that this is more of a mythological component. The image of the mother of all galaxies. In all mythologies about the creation of the world, there are direct references to the Milky Way. And the only stone that can "burn" is either a star or a black hole in the center. This is not a direct indication of where to fly, but rather an aphorism pointing to black holes or pulsars. Because pulsars are also stars.

To the whisperer in witchspace

Thargoids.

the siren of the deepest void

Black hole or pulsar.We can charge FSD from pulsars. But in those days there were no FSD except for rare prototypes.

A black hole or wormhole. All the ships and all the engines that in the old games and lore, that in the new lore and the current game, punch a tunnel from point A to point B, by creating a wormhole.

The parent's grief, the lover's woe, and the yearning of our vagabond hearts.

In fact, it can be interpreted as a description of adventures. Adventures or odysseys if you refer to Greece. But here we mean the term itself - adventure or path. And how its feels.

All the adventures and all the paths were near the bubble.

Also, let's take into account that not in the first not in the second elite there was no fsd. And according to modern lore, they appeared only in 3297. Before that, there were prototypes. Modern FSD tunnel to the right star and form a wormhole.

So do the thargoids, who open a wormhole and jump into it. So are the capitals.

Let's not forget that lore was retconned.

The main thing is that we (little men) jumped. Yes, these jumps were not for 30-50-100 light years, but only for 0.20-0.30-0.50 . But a wormhole was created in the same way. For everything else, relativistic acceleration was used.

And it was very easy to get lost.

Hence it can be assumed that someone in those days found a way to move faster than the engines allowed in those days.

Or you have created / found a device that allows you to jump very far. Further than modern fsds.

So this whole toast has almost zero value. Since it literally describes: let's drink to the cosmos, targoids, pulsars, and the desire to travel and thirst for discoveries.

The mythological component gives much more accurate clues. We need to find the Omphalos stone. This is most likely either a device, or a technology, or something else, as it was at one time with the Guardians technologies. And this technology or device will allow us to open a rift. Omphalos Rift.

Will it lead us to raxxla? who knows.

The main thing is that everything in lore revolves around thargoids and guardians. And therefore, my personal opinion, it is necessary to continue to look for everything that is connected in one way or another with them.

And of course, do not forget that many many players jump from point a to point b, skipping hundreds of systems. It is also very common to jump in the same plane when there are systems both at height and in depth.

So i guess: there is something near the buble or inside that will open a rift to something.

The only question is whether there is anything at all.

 

[Rochester]

You also have the oldest myth, of Apollo and the serpent Drakaina (also known as Drakon and Python) at Delhi (origin name Delphine); the ‘rift’ is mentioned in that story as the location where the beast was slain and then the temple was built on top of the rotting corpse.

Rotting Thargoid base on the planet that’s directly under the ‘Oracle’ in the Delphi system! First logical assumption on day 1… but nothing to back it up further as it’s the same as all the other dead hulks(?).

Delphi in reality is also based upon a very real geological fissure. So in the context of Delphi a ‘rift’ equates to crack in the ground.

In certain historical contexts it’s thought omphalos were meteorites, carved and venerated in the early cults…literally gifts from the gods.

 

[Louis Calvert]

Nice work @Suhurrat this might help:

---

Codex: Raxxla (published late 3304)
"... To the whisperer in witch-space, the siren of the deepest void! ..."

FORMIDINE RIFT ALPHA MISSION (Discovered early 3303)
Expedition Log: 28/08/3270
"Jump drive malfunctioned today ... Could have sworn I heard some weird voices in the last jump. ..."
Expedition Log: 07/10/3270
“I can’t bear another jump. The lights in witch-space are coming for me, the lights… always the lights… they’re calling to me… a siren song… I must join them…”

Galnet 3303 Hyperspace (Published early 3303)
"... Many pilots have reported glimpsing inexplicable lights, and even structures, within the witch-space tunnels. ..."

---

There's more references than this - but it's very clear there are huge signposts to Witch Space and they match pretty well parts of the Dark Wheel Toast. That's not a coincidence.

I think you're on the right path with that connection

 

[yelboc]

John Harper, author of Elite: Here Comes the Wheel, wrote in a comment on Kickstarter:
"You don't know what I saw. I sailed beyond the Formidine rift, saw a fleet of octagonal ships blocking the stars. I was standing on lost worlds, sterilized by the targoids and erased from the maps of humanity. I saw graves from the time of the Targoid wars, countless tombstones extending beyond the curvature of the horizon, small spots of reflected light dotting the abandoned continent.

Just wrt to this quote - it was written, afaik, at a time when the Thargoid story was mean to evolve in the Bovomit sector, which is out beyond the Formidine Rift. At some point the story got changed to the Plaeiades nebula instead, so the quote is a little out of date.

The rift is part of the story of Salome from Premonition, by Drew Wagar. The Exodus project had three destinations, basically as an escape route for the Club in the event of a thargoid invasion, so having one in the FR area woud obviously be counter-productive if the original quote were true.

Unfortunately plans change, and we have no idea what is relevant and what has been superseded, and its not in FD's best interests to let us know.

 

[Sublime]

Maybe! I think it's incredibly vague and disappointing tbh. Notice they wouldn't actually say "it's not significant", they dodged that question with a blanket "no comment".

Edit:

They can't confirm it's significant, understandably, that would be cheating.
However, imo they can confirm whether it's not significant because there's 400bn stars in the galaxy and limitless other options.
The fact they wouldn't confirm it's not signficant is susy imo.
But then, if they could confirm insignificance to the quest then we would eventually whittle down the options
So... maybe they never reply straight to any question.
= incredibly frustrating.

I would pay a billion credits to just ask an Earth historian about the Sol system over the last 1000 years. The fact we can't do that is irritating.

They did confirm it’s not significant. Their initial reply on it was that it simply didn’t make the cut, as they can’t add all 80+ moons and most have to be left out. They only started getting ambiguous with “no comment” after the issue was pressed….

As in… “Hey they seem really interested in it even after we said it was cut for practicality reasons, let’s just say no comment, it’ll keep them interested and guessing for a while longer.”

 

[SongOfTheVoid]

My theory is that, most likely, as developments for the elite, all available material was involved. Accordingly, we can roughly assume the location of certain objects. The fact that the siren in the depths is an 80% chance pulsar. Perhaps there should be something near the pulsar or in the system. But do not exclude black holes. Because in a system with a black hole, there may be third-party objects, including pulsars, although holes emit waves. In other words, it is worth looking at the central star and then at the filling of the system. In any case, at the moment that the targoids that the guardians, at least all and the main points next to sol.

Most of your observations are indeed correct including people wasting their time chasing esoteric or mythological aspects.
The Siren in the deepest void like all the other sayings has multiple meanings but without understanding each part of the quotes related science/meanings people will never get it, Cygni-X3 observations are correct though missing mentions of numerous aspects on what makes those star systems special, how many their really are ingame also. I believe until people realise you cannot ever just "Fly to some system and look around" and find it few will make any progress... They are assuming many things with this assumption mainly that it has a fixed location in space/time.
Please be aware the Galmap lies to players and has always and likely will, Systems have a grading system in which they can be 'Renamed to a generic RNG name and a RNG system given their name', 'Hidden from Visibility in the Galmap', 'Hidden from Visibility and Name hidden until searched for manually', 'Hidden appearance and name', Hidden 'Server Permissions' Flag not PermitLock (The game checks to see if yourve triggered X or Y global trigger, if not and you try to jump to system anyway the game crashes).
When you understand that the galaxymap undermines your ability to find things, it becomes clear this is intentional but unlike the masses who go "It must be nothing or not exist" yourll find 9/10 of systems claimed 'Not' to be ingame do actually exist ingame.

 

[Rochester]

That’s an interesting and very specific description, please elaborate on how you know that, how it was found, how it can be replicated?

 

[SongOfTheVoid]

That’s an interesting and very specific description, please elaborate on how you know that, how it was found, how it can be replicated?

As the greatest scientist the Empire has ever had its my duty to know more on my own than the collective masses of those outside the empire... In this case you should probably investigate HIP 95951, and I do mean HIP 95951 not the faked system using its name that is displayed nearby. (Spoilers this isnt a super secret its just a max stage hidden, 'requires a special server flag' to jump to one.. as Crash to desktop means there's no Exception error message thrown by the client which means its triggering a different crash from a server request. 15yrs working for AAA Games companies developing MMORPGs give you a appreciation for some of the mechanics going on under the hood as it were.)
*PS: You can generally find stars using many names despite ones shown, while compiling my own research into the extent of ThePilotsFederation and other organisations hiding information from CMDRs ingame i investigated several hundred if not thousand systems who did NOT appear in the public API list but do exist ingame to be found, commonly under multiple systems using variations of different indexes used. Which for the record is not the three alone people assume it to be but is select systems from several more indexes or notable scientific papers. Thus in the HIP95951 Case we have a star system that isnt (Or wasnt at the time) in the API index, but when checks were done for its numerous designations it provided the system information from a nearby (and wrong) system...

 

[Rochester]

Is this to do with the known bug due to duplication of stars?

Where a name from a star catalog can be entered and it takes you to a non existent star? But really the ‘real star’ is just next door and uses an alternative name?

I presume that’s due to use of duplicative star catalogs. That’s a known bug. We presume too there are ‘Dev’ systems / sectors only they can access for testing.

From what you’ve highlighted identifies a specific set of intentional flags which enforce limits on certain ‘hidden’ stars, insinuating that they can be visited if you hit a certain gate?

Not I presume gated because they are inserted by error, bugged or locked for devs?

Not being a coder I wouldn’t want to presume the meaning, or source, please elaborate, is this in game code, are these ‘description’ in game and how were they found?

Pics please?

As if there is a gating method that really does throw the cat out of the box.

This I find interesting because I was just discussing this theory. Originally certain missions were gated, you had to be Elite to see them; FD nerfed that cool idea, so that everyone could see and engage with them.

It made me wonder if certain system missions were still intentionally gated, eg some are not Elite so many theories are based on research, if there is a path and if it’s gated one would not be able to identify anything unless you hit certain requirements.

But certain activity is only logical if it’s intentional game mechanisms, if so why is FD not communicating that certain stars are hidden, then certain paths are intentionally hidden, it would encourage players to play the game, unless it’s intention is just to restrict access to Dev level areas, bugged data or archived content no longer intended for play?

Which is why we share data.

 

[Jorki Rasalas]

@Suhurrat above mentioned The Alien World and Egypt.
IIRC Holdstock in that book (very long time since I read it) had Raxxla related to a number of “Talmor Lenses” & one of those was a pyramid on Earth. Also IIRC the Egyptian pyramids were built so they pointed at a specific star, though that alignment has changed due to Earth’s precession over the millenia. It may be a silly question, but has anyone checked what the original star alignment was and checked that system in-game for anything unusual?