You....I like you.
Would like a new, different exploration ship from FD:
- Thread starter n13L5
- Start date
You....I like you.
![[Diplomacy] Carnegie](https://forums-cdn.zaonce.net/data/avatars/m/123/123809.jpg?1553527149){kind=avatar}
Everyone is obsessed with jump range which really isn't necessary for explorers, you lot are wishing for fast travel ships not exploration vehicles you miss a lot on the way if you jump past several hundred stars each time you jump.
For exploration you need good heat management and a giant fuel scoop so you can scoop quickly, plenty of internal compartments for equipment along with being a decently flyable ship so you can explore and land safely on high G worlds if you want to.
A 50ly jumpconda is rubbish for general exploration, it has crappy windows and terrible manoeuvrability, it has it's uses if you want to get somewhere fast or reach a particularly awkward star but since the advent of jumponium and the Neutron star boost you really don't need huge jump ranges built in to any exploration vessel.
For exploration you need good heat management and a giant fuel scoop so you can scoop quickly, plenty of internal compartments for equipment along with being a decently flyable ship so you can explore and land safely on high G worlds if you want to.
A 50ly jumpconda is rubbish for general exploration, it has crappy windows and terrible manoeuvrability, it has it's uses if you want to get somewhere fast or reach a particularly awkward star but since the advent of jumponium and the Neutron star boost you really don't need huge jump ranges built in to any exploration vessel.
Who decided that Anaconda is the best exploroship there is? Certainly not me. Some people think the best exploroship=ship who gives most ly jumprange, and frankly thats a boring way to look at things. And mentioning looking at things, Anaconda isnt that good for looking at things. What does exploration mean to individual commander may differ but the ship that offers quickest reach to beagle point with least amount of jump does not make that ship the best exploroship in my humble, and probably some others opinion, because I believe the main task there is to go sightseeing and finding new things, which can be done for a lifetimes lenght in a slightly modified Sidewinder. Finely tuned one would get a comfortable 30ly on it I think. Except very specific tasks like reaching a hard to reach corner of the galaxy, a good range that will save you from being stuck in between the gaps of far away stars is just enough. And thats more or less like 30ish ly range. Which brings us back to the question, if your intent is to just explore systems, you'd do just fine, considering jumping into a sector and scan systems one after other making 2ly jumps, one doesn't even need 30ly range. And frankly I cant wrap my mind around to find a reason for the bigger size the better approach for an exploroship too.
Ive done exploration on non engineered ships (hmm I think it there was no engineers in that time), engineered jump monsters and yes, to answer Verminstar on "how many explorers have anything in the hardpoints?" I have even explored in riddiculusly heavily fitted combat animals like a Corvette or heavy Anaconda with more or less 17-20ly ranges that were able take on PvP or a full fleet of elite NPCs head on and especially enjoyed my own unique approach to exploration with those. They did their job perfectly fine and as a person who enjoys "being prepared for anything" levels more or less on par with Batman himself, I enjoyed my time with them and enjoying their unique styles with all of them and took on the challenge of their disadvantages head on, so i dont know, surely we can always use and enjoy new and more ships but FD is currently giving us that.
All ships are (can be) exploro dedicated ships and scouts unless you've busted your FSD drive or forgot your ADS, DSS and scoop (and optionally SLF, SRV, AFMU) at home. We are good.
My next task in hand is to build a super sleek explorocourier. It's gonna be pretty legendary, I think. Mad thruster speed, 30-40ly performance, luxury look, unique cockpit... oh nevermind, don't get me started on building too much eagerness thinking about that [big grin]
Ive done exploration on non engineered ships (hmm I think it there was no engineers in that time), engineered jump monsters and yes, to answer Verminstar on "how many explorers have anything in the hardpoints?" I have even explored in riddiculusly heavily fitted combat animals like a Corvette or heavy Anaconda with more or less 17-20ly ranges that were able take on PvP or a full fleet of elite NPCs head on and especially enjoyed my own unique approach to exploration with those. They did their job perfectly fine and as a person who enjoys "being prepared for anything" levels more or less on par with Batman himself, I enjoyed my time with them and enjoying their unique styles with all of them and took on the challenge of their disadvantages head on, so i dont know, surely we can always use and enjoy new and more ships but FD is currently giving us that.
All ships are (can be) exploro dedicated ships and scouts unless you've busted your FSD drive or forgot your ADS, DSS and scoop (and optionally SLF, SRV, AFMU) at home. We are good.
My next task in hand is to build a super sleek explorocourier. It's gonna be pretty legendary, I think. Mad thruster speed, 30-40ly performance, luxury look, unique cockpit... oh nevermind, don't get me started on building too much eagerness thinking about that [big grin]
Last edited:
Again, this is like saying you don't need hard points on a combat vessel.
You don't need a high jump range to explore, BUT any ship designed to be an exploration vessel DOES need a high jump range. Because you simply can't explore a system if you can't reach it, and there are hundreds of millions of systems out there at extreme jump ranges. An exploration vessel should be capable of the job despite the pilots preferences to explore easy to reach areas.
Agreed. Just because an explorer doesn't *always* utilize a high jump range doesn't mean they don't need it. It's essential in the most remote areas of the galaxy- anyone who's ventured outside the bubble knows it.
Hence why the Anaconda is favored because of its ability to jump the furthest regardless of its status as a combat-multirole vessel. (for which most of the slots end up being useless when used as such... no one "fills" an Anaconda for this purpose)
But if the primary requirement of an exploration ship is jump range then you're never going to get a 'dedicated' explorer, since that jump range will be equally useful for long range passenger haulers. Add in all the module slots that (some) explorers demand and you're looking at a decent cargo ship.
As I said, you're not talking about a general exploration vessel, there are millions of stars still unexplored that are within easy reach of any ship that can manage a 20LY jump, you are laying specifications down for a highly specialised ship that most explorers will never need unless they have a specific, hard to reach destination in mind which most pilots don't they just want to get out into the galaxy and have a poke around.
Which by the way I already said but you chose not to quote.
Regarding your claim about hard points and combat ships, well that's more comparable to the type of design YOU are proposing, you could in fact build a ship for combat with no weapons if you designed it exclusively for ramming, it would be rubbish for most purposes but would be a highly specialised ship ideal for very rare and specific circumstances. Much like the high jump range ship you appear to want it would give up a whole lot of practicality in order to be very good at one thing that really isn't all that useful to most pilots.
I have been exploring since the game was in Alpha testing and I can say with 100% certainty that the ships current ability to jump five or six times further than they did at game launch does not make them better exploration vessels it just makes them get places faster which is NOT the same thing at all.
There was a specific star i wanted to get to and I had to wait until Jumponium was in the game and then build a stripped back maximum range jumpconda as no ship had the range to reach it until then, but even before that happened i had made Elite and made a fortune in exploration, at one point i was in the top 50 for discovered systems so I can categorically tell you that you DON'T need massive jump ranges to be a successful explorer.
Which is why I believe the entire ship range needs a good looking over.
Ships were introduced that essentially outclass "exploration" vessels in the areas that "exploration" vessels should be best at- but that's not the only factor.
Same thing goes for "cargo" vessels, a prime example of this being the Cutter- which basically put the Type-9 in "Least Likely To Be Used To Haul Cargo" status.
The list goes on and on and on...
I'm thinking out loud here and this might not make sense, but...
The only difference between exploration, trade and passenger ships is how you prioritize the modules.
From largest module to smallest:
Exploration - Fuel scoop, AFMU, shield
Trade - Cargo, cargo, shield
Passenger - Cabin, cabin, shield
Even miners kind of fit into that logic with cargo, refinery, limpet controller
The thing which breaks every 'dedicated' ship type is the 'Conda and its stupidly low mass. It needs nerfing.
Cutter is 3x the base price of the T-9, its internals are more expensive and it's rank-locked, so I don't see much problem with it being 'better'.
However, if you buffed the T-9's 7 compartment to an 8 (or nerfed one of the Cutter's 8s) then that issue goes away.
Agreed the Annie needs a good kick in the mass. Everyone knows it, and it would solve the problem with its outclassing jump range tremendously.
Also agree with Cutter vs T9 except the cost factor- no one pays attention to cost factor once you can afford a Cutter. Who the hell intentionally swaps to a lower class of ship to perform a job when you can easily afford a Cutter to begin with?
My point also being those aren't the only examples, however- there are a lot of others (I didn't even begin to mention Python, etc.)
Multiroles outclass defined role ships, period- end of story. It should not be the case, and until they fix this imbalance they will always outshine defined role ships. Multiroles should be "good" at everything but not the best at everything.
As I also stated, it would help tremendously if the "scanners" were all able to be equipped in Utility slots rather than "Exploration" scanners being forced into Internals, too. This would also alleviate a lot of the logistical issues faced by Explorers, IMO.
Last edited:
Congratulations on your accomplishments. A person does not need to jump massive ranges to be an explorer, I agree as that is personal preference, BUT any ship designed to be an exploration vessel DOES need to have a high jump range. It’s part of what defines a ship as an exploration vessel: being able to reach remote places that other ships can only dream of. Not all pilots want to go there, but any ship designated as an exploration vessel should be capable of it or it’s just poor design.
Like if the upcoming Chieftain was only sporting two small hardpoints. Sure pilots would be capable of combat in the most difficult of CZ’s with it, but that wouldn’t make it a proficient combat design, and I’d wager that most combat pilots would find it very lacking.
Exploration ships requiring long jump ranges isn’t about personal preference, it’s about viable ship design.
How about a dedicated Exploration Vessel with absolutely NO Hardpoints?
Make it small, Let it accommodate a single Luxury cabin, make it amazingly fast (450+), decent shields, an amazing jump range (50+), but absolutely NO GUNS. You only option is to run if attacked. Not much need for hardpoints anyway once you clear the bubble.
I would buy one.
Make it small, Let it accommodate a single Luxury cabin, make it amazingly fast (450+), decent shields, an amazing jump range (50+), but absolutely NO GUNS. You only option is to run if attacked. Not much need for hardpoints anyway once you clear the bubble.
I would buy one.
Folks, the only reason you need a high jump range, 30ish, is to reach those systems on the edges that are far apart. Your average jump will be less than 10. Don't confuse exploration with fast travel.
I'm not an explorer. I don't do any real exploration. The only way I'm going out past the bubble to do any exploring is if I can jump somewhere in a "reasonable" amount of time. (Similarly why I've never been to Colonia)
So maybe the ship doesn't REQUIRE a larger jump range, but I'm not grinding my way out into the black unless it has some very good jump range advantage...
So, Yeah. It needs a big jump range...
Sounds like an iCourier Explorer. I'd buy one.
I totally agree with this - though I'm not sure how it could be done, unless they implement equivalents to the military slots and module types which limit the configuration of multirole ships. Pretty sure that would generate a lot of salt though
