External View [A definitive discussion]

An External View yes or no, Multiple choice

  • Yes: an External View for Combat

    Votes: 28 8.8%
  • No: This will break immersion fo me

    Votes: 117 36.6%
  • Yes: I want to know from where I am being attacked from

    Votes: 16 5.0%
  • No: the Scanner is all you need.

    Votes: 103 32.2%
  • Yes: a Simple external ship viewer None Combat

    Votes: 161 50.3%
  • No: Keep everything within the ship

    Votes: 105 32.8%

  • Total voters
    320
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Will FD have out side views per FE_II:rolleyes:
I would like to know from someone in production.
If no, then I can quit wasting my time and delete from HD.:D

A simple Yes or No e_mail will suffice.:smilie:

Will there be 3rd person view?
That may be the communities stance on it but it's not ours. We don't want 3rd person view to be implemented in a non-fictional way as our current debug cameras act in our local builds. 3rd person view will be implemented at some point using drones that keep them firmly in the fiction of the universe and can't be used to give an alternative point of view for flying as that isn't how we want player's to experience the game. We want an in-cockpit experience for flying but 3rd person drones will allow you to inspect your ship or to do beauty shots etc.

How about External Camera?
We are looking at external camera views, with the following caveats:
* They are contextualised as camera/drone systems
* They are not designed to be used as alternate flight views
* Their primary function is to allow "beauty shots"
* They may have occasional tertiary game play functions (such as seeing how close you are to something)
 
I'm not fussed about 3rd-person view drones, to be honest. If they're implemented then groovy.

What I'd love to do (and I've mentioned this in similar threads before), is replay a sequence I was in, after the fact, in 3rd person. A few games have this I believe.

That wouldn't break immersion as far as playing the game goes, solves the problem of using 3rd-person views as a tactic, and would allow for beauty shots - especially if you could move the 3rd-person replay POV around.

Scenario : you've just been in an epic fight where either you got blown up or your opponent did. Hit the aforementioned Replay function and replay the sequence, positioning the POV to take a snapshot of the moment something blew up.

What's not to like? ;)
 
people feel the same way about gimbled weapons, breaking immersion from the fight making it too easy and feeling detached.

Gimbals exist on planes, however. Astral projection is not quite so plausible.

i hear time and time again how FD wanted it to feel like a ww2 dogfight. sometimes i can play 1 handed with the mouse and rest my chin on the other when fighting the AI. so i try not to use them like you could choose not too use 3rd person view

Yes, I could, but then you would have a major advantage with your ability to leave your body and float in space, seeing stuff that your in-game character shouldn't be able to see.

frontier had 3rd person view.

Frontier also had the ability to speed up and slow down time, but that is unrealistic in a multiplayer environment - as is magic floaty cam.

yes we know its tryin to stay realistic but theres also a lot of gamey unrealistic stuff too, if you don't want to play a game where your looking at your ship fly through space 'staring you' then don't use it, nobody would force you too, the real issue i guess is you think it will make people better at dog fighting or els you wouldn't throw your dummy out the minuet somebody raises the point of 3rd person. it wouldn't be mandatory to have to use it.

<JUST A MINUET>BZZZ - Repetition!</JUST A MINUET> I refer the Rt Hon Member to the reply I gave some moments ago.

head tracking gives advantages also but you don't see people going on a rant about the people that use it.

Not yet, you don't. I wager that may change as the majority demographic for the game shifts away from obsessive nerds with lots of disposable income. Besides, a player can look around pretty well with the mouse alone, or a key binding can enable freelook mode, without getting a sore neck after a couple of hours in the cockpit.

anyway im not fussed either way
Evidently.

but i would like to look at the ship i like and bought, also the paint job i spent money on, you know to help me get through those long runs in the 400 billion systems with 37 other people playing

Took a while to admit that any arguments you have made so far were a transparent attempt to deflect from the truth - your vanity. How is your motivation any different from one of those orangey duck-lipped beings that fill Facebook with hundreds of pictures of themselves wearing the same expression?

you never know those movies people will make with it might bring more people into the game :eek:

You know, I don't think that's going to be a problem. I'm not channeling Nostradamus when I say that I can foresee this will reach a decent audience, even without the aid of 30,000 almost identical Youtube clips of ships flying through (an asteroid belt/a station entrance/a dogfight) to a soundtrack of (John Williams/Muse/Skrillex/the uploader's humorous commentary).

ps.. just thought of another immersion breaking feature, flying up to another ship and looking at the cockpit to realize there is nobody flying it lol.

Beta.

the same AI names (cult sci-fi movie puns) over n over again

(sigh...) Beta

or the 4 vipers that enter the star port area and break formation as soon as you jump in

Do I even need to repeat it at this point?

...

Ok then "Beta". But that's the last time.

and finally the piece of furniture that is the dreadnaught in The war zone that takes no more damage and get sidewinders stuck in its orifices and slowly pushed along.

...I said that was the last time.

outside cam would just kill it

Not kill it, but it probably would negatively affect the sense of being there and therefore the enjoyment levels, unless it was heavily restricted (i.e. it offered absolutely NO gameplay advantage whatsoever).
 

Philip Coutts

Volunteer Moderator
we already have a thread for this.. can we not lock and direct to the correct place, or merge?

Several threads I think.....;)

For what it's worth an external view using drones is the way to go for me. I do think that if you are selling skins for ships you have to let people have the opportunity to see them in some form.
 
Several threads I think.....;)

For what it's worth an external view using drones is the way to go for me. I do think that if you are selling skins for ships you have to let people have the opportunity to see them in some form.

I agree. I think that drones make sense, and I think that it should be possible that a pilot's vanity can have negative consequences. If someone is too busy admiring themselves to concentrate on keeping safe, it seems only fair (and hilarious) that their fancy ship might become fancy scrap metal as a result.
 
I think what's actually required is one of those Coriolis' to install a large mirror on one of their sides. Then the rest of us can enjoy the spectacle of ships lining up to admire themselves. If only ships had cameras, then they could also take selfies. Watch out for pirates! :p
 
Magic floaty cams? haha we already have drone mounted cameras, I'm sure that in 1300 years time we will not have forgotten how to make them.

I would say that for balance and to avoid breaking immersion:

* Drone cannot be launched in SC (seems obvious but has to be mentioned)
* Drone can only be launched when ships speed is 0
* Using the Drone deactivates shields so that it doesn't get destroyed by them
* A launch animation is used that takes a few seconds
* Drone has a limited range from the ship so it cannot be used to see round corners etc

This should preclude the drones use from any kind of combat situation and limit its use to the intended purpose. Its a beautiful universe, why not have your ship in shot while you photograph two suns simultaneously rise over a planet? Isn't that a big part of having such beauty?
 
Modern jet liners have cameras on the tail, in the nose, and looking down, so passengers (and presumably crew) can see whats happening. I think its also useful to see if there is something wrong with the aircraft.

Most dogfight capable planes have some sort of mirror device at the very least to allow you to look behind.

So I don't see how this removes immersion. If your view is from a fixed point tail cam, you can see most of yourself and judge distances with docking better probably.
 
I agree with Codec.

If we had cameras mounted on your tail, left and right, top and bottom, and then place the view from these cameras in a pop up window (say on the left). So that it looks like a video screen - just like you get in fancy cars these days.

It would not violate any immersion rules.

I don't agree with the third person views.

You could have drones to deployed and let them show the view from it on the video screen (as above)
 
Done to death.... External view for screenshots will possibly be made available... much like the search function is already available.... Use the sodding thing please folks....

It's getting boring seeing the same old discussions coming up again and again... If you want to talk about it use the already existing threads! Please....
 
Views similar to the original Elite would be nice.
(with the addition of an above and below views?)

The only views the original had was front/back/left/right

No outside views at all.

I don't mind having an external view for stuff like taking screenshots but your weapons MUST be disabled when using it imo. anything else is dumb.
 
The only views the original had was front/back/left/right

No outside views at all.

I don't mind having an external view for stuff like taking screenshots but your weapons MUST be disabled when using it imo. anything else is dumb.

No control of the ship at all imo, if you are flying the drone you are flying the drone. also you should have no shields either since the drone would disintegrate in them
 
Thanks for your helpful reply.
The link wasn't exactly a yes or no.

Ill check back in a month or two.

It wasn't a simple one word yes or no, however if you read the full post and the subsequent thread in detail it really does answer your question quite clearly. Breaking it down, the simple answer comes in two parts it would seem: yes to the external views, no to it being like Frontier/FFE, as I already mentioned in one of your other threads.

I can't really see why you would want or need a better answer than that at this stage unless you're clinging to the memory of earlier games and praying that things will change drastically before ED goes live, which isn't going to happen. Frontier have made their thoughts quite clear on this topic on numerous occasions: they are not remaking an earlier game verbatim, they are creating a new game using modern technology set in the same world and they're making the game they want the way they want it :D
 

Tar Stone

Banned
Can we just put a big mirror on the back of a couple of the stations, and then anyone who wants to admire their ship can float over there and knock themselves out.

In fact we could create a consensual mirror gazing group just for vanity excursions. This would exist in its own instance, in its own seperate galaxy and universe of course, so as not to unbalance anyone who would get caught in the mirror sneaking up behind them to fire off a few cheeky missiles.

The Vanity Mirror could be explained via in-game lore - we'll just say they are repurposed mirrors from giant telescopes built to provide live TV feeds of deathmatches and capture the flag events in outer systems.

Everyone got bored of the deathmatches after five minutes, the TV stations sold the 'scopes and went into the more lucrative business of selling virtual spaceships to the vegetoid slug people of Ursa Minor.
 
Some form of 3rd person must be included eventually.

Clearly lots of people want it.

When the game is eventually released, the same proportion of reviewers will also want it and may be critical of the game for not having it. This is surely not a good marketing strategy. Why invite criticism? Yes the Devs are "making the game for themselves", but they're also pitching it to the world as a commercial product.

Players who don't want it (because it breaks immersion blah blah blah)....should simply not use it (not rocket science)

Personally I'd very much like a 3rdPP option.
 
Yes - Non-combat external views would be nice.. (Perhaps fly-by cam only, or an external cam that can only be used when weapons are stowed.)
Particularly as we are paying for paint jobs.

But on the subject of views, have I mentioned internal camera/mirrors? :p

So very much hope they get included..
 
Some form of 3rd person must be included eventually.

Clearly lots of people want it.


Personally I'd very much like a 3rdPP option.

I you add up the yes and no poll it clearly seams that most people don't


Totals for Poll "An External View yes or no"
TOTAL VOTING NO :101.25%
TOTAL VOTING YES :64.17%
 
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