How Open-only would balance ED

Robert Maynard

Volunteer Moderator
Bottom line is that any game with a shared setting cannot allow it's players to dictate their own unique set of rules, because the most effective set of rules possible is going to give greatest agency to those that use it, making all other options disadvantageous.
Just as well that players can't create a unique set of rules then - we all play by the same rules, regardless of game mode. The choices we make can certainly affect our game experience though.
 
Just as well that players can't create a unique set of rules then

I think an offline/private server option where we could fully dictate the rules we, and anyone who chose to connect to our own server, played by would significantly mitigate the abuses/rules violations we see in the current game, as well as give Frontier a way to permanently remove disruptive elements from the MMO game without violating any consumer protection laws.

I've never pushed for an Open-only game, but the lack of an offline game underpins many of the problems with the online one.
 
In my own case, I do enjoy open gameplay - but only when one of these criteria are met:
  • Playing online with like-minded gamers as part of an organization (I do that in Star Citizen each Saturday)
  • Real mechanics exist to prohibit or diminish in-game jackassery ("lulz cry moar - git gud nooob!")
If those are lacking, open gameplay doesn't interest me.

I'd be content just to play without internet sociopaths. As is I play in open frequently, but only in certain anti-murderhobo ships.

(good to see you out here GreySix, hope you're enjoying the game so far)
 
Disclaimer - I am NOT advocating for Open-Only, I'm just making an observation.

Today I decided to join the Tritium Truckers, in hopes to make some meager credits to help me slowly progress to my goal of someday owning a fleet carrier. The best prices were between two outposts, so I configured my Python for cargo running and started my trucking - in a private group. Was I worried about gankers? A little, but not terribly so. No, what I wanted to avoid was an insane line of CMDRs all competing for that one medium pad. And that's when it dawned on me - everyone lining up for a great deal is realistic, and I'm basically "cheating" (figuratively, not literally) by creating my own parallel universe Walmart on Black Friday where there are no lines.

If the game was Open-only, these lines would force players to spread out and accept less than the perfect exchange rates in trade, thus bringing balance to the game. It would also bring legitimate PvP piracy (something I enjoy), and yes, ganking, which would also balance the game. I'm not saying it's a perfect solution, heck it's not a solution at all (modes are here to stay), but I do think that a large contributor to the success of all these gold rushes is that we can create our own private realities where we don't have to deal with long lines, criminals, and other realistic challenges. And because of this, I do think the game is less than what it could be.

And yet, here I am trading in the safety of a PG / Solo, so I guess I want a FC more than I want realism at the moment, LOL.

EDIT - I just found a route between two large stations, but the theory still applies I believe. Just consider some of the traffic jams we used to see during community goals.

YES, YES, YES, YES, YES, YES, YES, YES PLEASE!
 

Robert Maynard

Volunteer Moderator
I think an offline/private server option where we could fully dictate the rules we, and anyone who chose to connect to our own server, played by would significantly mitigate the abuses/rules violations we see in the current game, as well as give Frontier a way to permanently remove disruptive elements from the MMO game without violating any consumer protection laws.

I've never pushed for an Open-only game, but the lack of an offline game underpins many of the problems with the online one.
While a private server (that would still require to be online if it was to be multi-player) might offer options for some players, I expect that the semi-mythical shadow-ban server (where players apparently don't affect the galaxy but can still play) and the terms of the EULA / ToS already permit Frontier to deal with players who engage in abuse / rules violations.
 
Offline mode would definitely balance my rubbish internet.
I actually held off on buying ED for the longest time because it was online even in singleplayer/solo mode, because what I really wanted was a game with a story. A branching storyline, even, where I could reload an old save and see "I wonder what would have happened if I'd joined the empire instead of the federation".

Basically what I was after was a spaceflight sim with the narrative structure of something like Fallout: New Vegas. You can't have that with a persistent online world.
 
that would still require to be online if it was to be multi-player

LAN play!

Anyway, the distinction is who hosts and has control over the server and it's contents. In the offical MMO online game, this would have to be Frontier. For a private server, this would be the end-user.

I expect that the semi-mythical shadow-ban server (where players apparently don't affect the galaxy but can still play) and the terms of the EULA / ToS already permit Frontier to deal with players who engage in abuse / rules violations.

Probably, but for whatever reason they don't seem willing to use the option very often.
 
I can see your point, OP.

But I play another game (currently in alpha development) that has only open gameplay, and the developers are working to find an effective means to tamp down on highly-skilled pilots in overpowered vessels from making mincemeat of players in smaller vessels who've no wish for PvP play. No end of heated debate and half-baked "fixes" have ensued. Even with the "fixes" in-game, gank squads and murder hobos constantly chase players from the game who simply want to enjoy the game their own way.

I am pleased E-D mostly avoids that with their solo option.

Choice is good.
What game is this?
 
You guys are turning this into PvP vs PvE (of which we have endless threads), but the main premise of my thread is about player congestion around busy stations as a "regulator" to dissuade everyone from using the same get rich routes at the same time. It would force players to spread out to other markets, thus theoretically reducing the effects of these over-the-top gold rushes.

It,s what is happening with FCs that are available in all modes. Once a popular system is full people have no choice but to find other systems to do their things.
 
You keep asking apparently rhetorical questions followed by incorrect answers.

If I'm doing BGS work, and I don't have to worry about any NPC ever interfering with my CMDR, I can take more missions, move more cargo, and do so more rapidly, or with greater levels of automation than would otherwise be possible. Anyone not playing without NPCs would be at a tangible disadvantage.



Depends on the scenario and the players involved.

System control and states, determined by BGS mechanisms, are a major gameplay activity for many players, and produce effects readily apparent to many more.



You have no idea what you're talking about.

That my general statement lack specificity should not be taken as an inability to provide specificity when given a specific scenario to consider.

If you can't notice who controls what systems, what services are available at what stations, what's legal or illegal, how much modules or commodities cost, etc and so forth, that's on you.



I see these things, they affect my play, and your play has an impact on them.

Many players have more invested in the state of the BGS than you do in the effects of NPC interactions with your CMDR.

Bottom line is that any game with a shared setting cannot allow it's players to dictate their own unique set of rules, because the most effective set of rules possible is going to give greatest agency to those that use it, making all other options disadvantageous.

It's amazing, what can I say, congratulations on your hattrick. My answers may be 'incorrect' in the context of your concept of what a game is. Sadly, that seems to be rather narrow. And because I don't agree with you, I don't know "what I am talking about", as you rebut me with your 'tangible' answers. I just find your three recent replies absurd and the premise of your arguments myopic and petty. I guess we all have bad days, eh.

All of a sudden you're resorting to straw man over npc's not being involved now at all when I never said that. Someone is in a traffic jam and says "I wish cars weren't in my way", what would you stretch that to, destroying all machines? Probably. The way you took a small point and used that as the whole start of your argument - well, hats off to you for creativity.

The effect on the BGS from being caught in NPC traffic is virtually nothing, you know it is, I know it is. Pretend otherwise. So what's this 'many' players you are talking about? Yes, there is an amount - once again, you can't quantify it. Perhaps - a tiny minority? So, we should cater to their whims above everyone else? No. People will play the game they want to play. Respect the BGS to the point of paralysis is not one of them. Besides, what with all the hacks and cheats at BGS people's fingers, how can they be taken credibly? You want fair? Play on PS4. Like me. :D

If you can't notice who controls what systems, what services are available at what stations, what's legal or illegal, how much modules or commodities cost, etc and so forth, that's on you.

No, you got that wrong. Substitute "notice" for "care". I don't play for those reasons, and don't have to. If you can't notice a butterfly flapping its wings in Mongolia, that's on you. Only thing is, that's real, your BGS is fake, doesn't exist and was not designed to be taken seriously. It supports the fun, the game. It is a tool to the game, not a master. The game does not bow before it. Thank God. So, off to Mongolia with a trilby and magnifying glass for you.

I love Test Match Cricket. I'm not going to lecture you on bringing mid-off wider because the ball is holding up in the wicket, nor be disappointed if you said you didn't know/care. It's a game. This is a game. You know that, right? Designed to entertain the masses. Not a career.

I will play whatever way I want to, within the rules not , and I defend everyone's right to do so. Even yours. If you don't agree, the problem is yours.

"That my general statement lack specificity should not be taken as an inability to provide specificity when given a specific scenario to consider."

Do you even know what that means? What sort of a meaningless statement is that?

Honestly, you can carry on with this sort of Big Bang Theory shenanigans all you like. Here's no rhetorical questions for you. You are wrong, the experience since the game launched proves you are wrong, FD are not enforcing what you are saying so you are wrong, people will mostly* (well, you can quantify on no data, so I can too) not care about the BGS and play their own way. You're wrong. You lose. You're playing the wrong game. But that's okay, because Elite is so diverse and so jack-of-all-trades-master-of-none, we'll let you stay.

I'm sure you're a nice bloke and all that, I've taken up too much of your time when you could be out ganking influencing the background o7
 
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I think an offline/private server option where we could fully dictate the rules we, and anyone who chose to connect to our own server, played by would significantly mitigate the abuses/rules violations we see in the current game, as well as give Frontier a way to permanently remove disruptive elements from the MMO game without violating any consumer protection laws.

I've never pushed for an Open-only game, but the lack of an offline game underpins many of the problems with the online one.

There is hope! Ye gads!
 

Robert Maynard

Volunteer Moderator
Two modes, open PVP and open PVE, no instancing, everybody in that mode plays together
Why should players who want to play in Solo or Private Groups be denied that, just because some players want everyone to play together?

.... and, after the furore surrounding the removal of Offline mode from the scope, just before launch, I doubt that Frontier would remove Solo.
 
Mr Maynard, can you add some information about events around the removal of Offline mode, because I remember vaguely there being a stack of controversy, I was put off buying the game for a long time, and certain people were accused of 'breaking promises'. I'm not sure how many people here are aware of this.
 
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