This doesn't really feel like a thread for features planet zoo 2 needs but an argument over sandbox and franchise players on what features should be available from the get-go. What's the point? Arguing over why a creative management game has a sandbox mode with everything unlocked is going nowhere because it is one of the core features of the game - franchise and challenge are seperate gamemodes for those who love the challenge of unlocking features gradually instead of given the entire creative palette at once.
Features that Planet Zoo 2 DEFINITELY needs?
- Thread starter SleepyEngi
- Start date
Yeah this is definitely not about animals. It's alternative decorations for what we would already have- so say, a second doughnut shop brand, so sandbox players would obviously still have a doughnut shop by default. Or a fifth alternative style for a ticket booth. Or a 6th different set of clothes for zookeepers/players. And a tiny amount of them- I doubt there will be much missions, so naturally there would be at maximum 20 reward pieces. You would have PLENTY of alternatives for each and every single one of them. This is just meant to throw a bone to challenge/franchise/career players and give them more unique rewards that don't feel completely worthless.
Let's remember that there are players who play ALL of the gamemodes. Players who play franchise, career, challenge and sandbox. If you make these "rewards" be available in sandbox right away- then they're not really rewards are they? They're just blocked from the gamemodes you are playing to unlock them- and that makes it entirely pointless to include them in the first place. All of these rewards are meant to be easily replaceable- but also feel unique and rewarding- this is important to please the regular gamemode players, even when they also play sandbox. So please, don't think about just yourself and try to throw a bone to these players who want rewards that feel worth it for progressing and completing the regular gamemodes. I'm not asking for a lot here. Consider that this is a large part of the fanbase that has a underdeveloped mode and try to grant them a little bit of attention there- most of my suggestions do apply to making sandbox better as well- this is just one that's specifically for those of us who enjoy the regular gamemodes.
Yeah I would say this is unnecessarily devolving into a huge argument over what is fundamentally a really tiny ask- Having more unique rewards for completing one of the gamemodes. As I have shown with data, franchise, challenge and career are a significant part of the fanbase. Not having the second or third alternative brand for a doughnut shop won't leave a gaping hole in your zoo and make you unable to complete the zoo of your dreams because it had a slightly different drawing on it- there's already an infinite amount of alternative pieces you don't have because they have not been made. Throw a bone to the players who enjoy rewards. Just one tiny little bone- that's all I'm asking. 0.3% (Or less depending on how many new pieces they add) of your available pieces is not a big deal- sacrifice a little bit for the MAJORITY who play the other gamemodes.
I don't. As I said, I don't even play sandbox, as long as there's a franchise mode where I can trade animals with other players. But since you're telling all the other people disagreeing with you here they're selfish because they don't want you to force your rules on them, maybe it's not them who are the wrong-way-drivers. They have the same right to play their preferred mode as you do. But you want to force rules of your preferred play style on their play style, while they don't want to alter other modes at all. You can have all your rewards and unlockables in your challenge mode if you want. You don't even need to ever touch sandbox if the freedom there isn't appealing for you. So why on earth force rules into a play style you don't even use? Just to pee off the sandbox players because others think it's lame that they could have the stuff in that one mode, they don't even play?
Just leave it to them then. No one's forcing you to play with everything unlocked.
I also play sandbox. I have played all the gamemodes. I am one of these players who enjoy all the gamemodes.
Don't put words in my mouth. That is in response to the same people calling the franchise, challenge and career gamemodes "extra" and "not the focus of the game"- thinking only of themselves and that their experience is the majority's experience. As I have shown - it is not. There is a large portion that plays outside sandbox, so consider their experience and how it could be greatly improved for those who like rewards in gaming. This feature has been a thing since the days of Zoo Tycoon.
Again, these rewards would be pointless to even include if they can be unlocked by default. These rewards are meant to give the player global progress- across all zoos- even those in sandbox mode. These are rewards for people who play only these gamemodes- and also for people who play all the gamemodes. These people should also feel like their reward meant something. And for that- we give them a tiny, little reward- a measly 20 pieces (or less)- all of which have great alternatives for those who don't care to go through the effort of unlocking them. This mechanic is already in the game. All I'm asking is that these rewards be slightly more unique- instead of every single one of them being another animal statue and material. If you are so entitled that you think these people can't have a tiny little reward without infringing on your experience- then yeah, you are being self centered. I'm asking for almost nothing here. More unique rewards- than those we already have. You are already locked out of these statues in sandbox mode- but you have great alternatives, so people don't care. This is the same case here- I am suggesting to give everyone great alternatives so they don't care. So please, just concede a little for the enjoyment of a large portion of the fanbase.
And again #2: It's not the sandbox players fault when the trophy hunters can't stand the thought that the mode they don't need to use has these pieces for free. It doesn't give them the right to cut the sandbox players creativity and freedom.
"Build the zoo of your dreams"
But speaking as the self-centered person you wanna see in me, I'm out of here, cause this discussion leads nowhere. Have a nice day
Same here, it's not the fault of the majority of players of 3/4ths of the available gamemodes that sandbox players can't stand the thought of being locked out of a measly 20 pieces out of over 6000 that all have alternatives because they have to have every single piece (They already do not, there are the locked statues and several pieces that can only be unlocked through mods), and they aren't entitled to veto an entire feature that is part of most modern games because of it. You can still build the zoo of your dreams without the third brand of doughnuts because right now you only have one anyway. There's an infinite amount of them that you do not have access to. So maybe let people ask for a tiny little thing even if it ruins your dream zoo by... locking you out of a single doughnut brand that you have an alternative to.And again #2: It's not the sandbox players fault when the trophy hunters can't stand the thought that the mode they don't need to use has these pieces for free. It doesn't give them the right to cut the sandbox players creativity and freedom.
"Build the zoo of your dreams"
But speaking as the self-centered person you wanna see in me, I'm out of here, cause this discussion leads nowhere. Have a nice day
I play franchise mode about 90 percent of the time. I really don't see why restricting what sandbox players can use would make the game mode more fun for me. I like the idea of unlocks and progression, but the appeal behind getting them should be that the process of unlocking is fun, not that I have something you have to grind to get.
There were some good ideas in the op, but the time frame thing seems like a complicated problem with no ideal solution. I agree that the pacing in the game makes one feel a bit more distant, and having a 200-year-old zoo is silly. And the rapid pace of the game makes it complex to articulate things like seasonal changes, weather, and those ridiculous alerts that an animal is too hot or too cold because the weather changed and it takes too long for them to finish their meal or even walk to the shelter.
But having it be a big deal to get to 5 years is problematic too, especially in franchise where the point is to get an economically self-sufficient zoo with a breeding program that is improving the genetics over generations. And having the babies grow up etc. is a fun part of the game too.
The problem is definitely the trade off between needing a time frame that allows years to pass in a reasonable time frame for breeding and income generation versus a time frame with the daily cycles and sort of real time behaviors of the animals and guests.
I'd like to see some improvements in animal behavior and biology to make them more realistic in some ways (fix the thing where chimps have the same social system as gorillas, for instance) and allowing players in franchise mode actually able to visit/tour one another's zoos in real time, maybe even opt in to chat with each other in game.
The conservation credits thing is, I think, an attempt to recreate the way zoos do business with one another, where the buying and selling of animals with money is actually not allowed. Zoos and aquariums trade animals with one another, and there is a system where value of animals is calculated based on things like rarity, appeal etc. Having players trading directly with one another, via personal interactions, in franchise would probably be more realistic, but it could also make it harder for folks who play at times when few others are online or who aren't as good at networking (or prefer a more solitary play style). One reason I play franchise mode is that the animal trading is generally much better than in the offline modes where the only animals available are the frontier specimens, often very poor ones, or all one sex versus the other. And it's fun seeing the names other players give some of their animals and their zoos.
But having it be a big deal to get to 5 years is problematic too, especially in franchise where the point is to get an economically self-sufficient zoo with a breeding program that is improving the genetics over generations. And having the babies grow up etc. is a fun part of the game too.
The problem is definitely the trade off between needing a time frame that allows years to pass in a reasonable time frame for breeding and income generation versus a time frame with the daily cycles and sort of real time behaviors of the animals and guests.
I'd like to see some improvements in animal behavior and biology to make them more realistic in some ways (fix the thing where chimps have the same social system as gorillas, for instance) and allowing players in franchise mode actually able to visit/tour one another's zoos in real time, maybe even opt in to chat with each other in game.
The conservation credits thing is, I think, an attempt to recreate the way zoos do business with one another, where the buying and selling of animals with money is actually not allowed. Zoos and aquariums trade animals with one another, and there is a system where value of animals is calculated based on things like rarity, appeal etc. Having players trading directly with one another, via personal interactions, in franchise would probably be more realistic, but it could also make it harder for folks who play at times when few others are online or who aren't as good at networking (or prefer a more solitary play style). One reason I play franchise mode is that the animal trading is generally much better than in the offline modes where the only animals available are the frontier specimens, often very poor ones, or all one sex versus the other. And it's fun seeing the names other players give some of their animals and their zoos.
I think making everything Time related like the 5 Times slower Option, would work quite good. In my Opinion it extends it good but not too much and you get more excited for Offspring because it doesn't get constantly shot out like from a Cannon, but you have to actually wait for them to be born.
Love that extended Time. The only Reason why I don't use it, is because I don't like how the Animal Age and the Years get disconnected from each other, so I would absolutely love if this would become the Standard Time in the Sequel
Flying Birds, fully Marine animals are a must as far as animal rosters go.
Relating to animals, I'd also like to see some individuality - make more of an effort to make animals a little different from one another. Brought up in the past maybe have 3 or 4 personality traits for each animal, much like we have with genetics. Animals would scale towards either social or loner, active or lazy, curious or shy for example.
Features I'd like to see:
Being able to maintain multiple franchises instead of just one (in franchise mode). For instance, I have about 35 franchise zoos at this point, all connected through the current franchise system. When the game ends official support I'm going to create a series of zoos more focused on a brand, with commonalities. I will have to fold those into my current franchise, but what I really wish I could do would be to open up another franchise completely for just those zoos. Start from scratch just for those zoos, even the building theme sets.Trade only between those zoos, not the other zoos I have in franchise.
A completely revamped or additional challenge mode. I'll be honest, I really haven't put much into challenge mode at all. The whole researching every theme with every single zoo is annoying (it's different if I do it for an entire franchise like the above point, I'd just be doing it once more for however many zoos I'd have). The animals I wouldn't mind researching animals so much but the building theme, not so much. And yet....Challenge mode still has issues IMO. You don't have the trade market with other players, which I understand is the main point, but that doesn't mean the challenge mode market is overflowing with animals. If anything I remember it was even more of a headache to get species you wanted.
This is what I propose for challenge mode instead, as others have mentioned - make it to where the zoos operate on a tier system. You start out with one star zoos and build up from there. The market would run more like Sandbox's market instead of Franchises, with the different being you are actually spending zoo dollars and CCs on animals. but the animals would always be available, or at least up to the star tier you unlocked. You earn your way to the bigger animals. I don't know how I'd handle researching things - yes to animals but no to themes?
Finally the other big change I'd make -- make the basic pieces from all of the building sets flexicolor. I mean, the walls, the floors/ceilings and the roofs at least.
Relating to animals, I'd also like to see some individuality - make more of an effort to make animals a little different from one another. Brought up in the past maybe have 3 or 4 personality traits for each animal, much like we have with genetics. Animals would scale towards either social or loner, active or lazy, curious or shy for example.
Features I'd like to see:
Being able to maintain multiple franchises instead of just one (in franchise mode). For instance, I have about 35 franchise zoos at this point, all connected through the current franchise system. When the game ends official support I'm going to create a series of zoos more focused on a brand, with commonalities. I will have to fold those into my current franchise, but what I really wish I could do would be to open up another franchise completely for just those zoos. Start from scratch just for those zoos, even the building theme sets.Trade only between those zoos, not the other zoos I have in franchise.
A completely revamped or additional challenge mode. I'll be honest, I really haven't put much into challenge mode at all. The whole researching every theme with every single zoo is annoying (it's different if I do it for an entire franchise like the above point, I'd just be doing it once more for however many zoos I'd have). The animals I wouldn't mind researching animals so much but the building theme, not so much. And yet....Challenge mode still has issues IMO. You don't have the trade market with other players, which I understand is the main point, but that doesn't mean the challenge mode market is overflowing with animals. If anything I remember it was even more of a headache to get species you wanted.
This is what I propose for challenge mode instead, as others have mentioned - make it to where the zoos operate on a tier system. You start out with one star zoos and build up from there. The market would run more like Sandbox's market instead of Franchises, with the different being you are actually spending zoo dollars and CCs on animals. but the animals would always be available, or at least up to the star tier you unlocked. You earn your way to the bigger animals. I don't know how I'd handle researching things - yes to animals but no to themes?
Finally the other big change I'd make -- make the basic pieces from all of the building sets flexicolor. I mean, the walls, the floors/ceilings and the roofs at least.
Last time I'm replying to this as I feel like I'm talking to a brick wall. I don't mind, in fact I encourage, any and all improvements to modes that are not sandbox mode. This should however never mean that people who just want to play sandbox cannot play with all content. Mods should never be the solution for this. I dislike that I have to rely on mods to get color morphs to show up in sandbox. Unfortunately I do. I believe this should be fixed for a future PZ game. My wanting this to be unlocked in sandbox, doesn't change anything about franchise. It will still be an achievement on its own to breed a color morph in franchise and/or aquire one from the trade center and build a complete breeding program around this one individual to fix the trait in future offspring. This is very fun to do in franchise but extremely tedious and annoying in sandbox.
The same holds true for me for any unlocks, including the awful bronze, silver and gold reward statues. They should be available by default in sandbox. This doesn't remove the accomplishment of unlocking them for franchise mode players for example. All I, and all others that are disagreeing with you, am saying is that having things unlocked in sandbox shouldn't afect your enjoyment in any other mode. And again, I play Franchise, Challenge and Sandbox, depending on my mood. I don't feel that my mod making color morphs more common in sandbox affects my enjoyment of franchise or challenge mode at all, nor would an actual function to make the perfect animal in sandbox affect my enjoyment of franchise/challenge. Just like having all items/functions available from the get go in sandbox doesn't impact my enjoyment of unlocking them over and over again in challenge mode because I want to be challenged when I'm playing that mode which includes unlocking stuff.
To conclude: PZ2 should have the best of both worlds. A challenge for those that want it with rewards that affect that particular game mode only AND the creative freedom to have ALL items/functions/animals/color morphs/whatever unlocked in sandbox mode for those that just want to play sandbox with the full availabilities the game has to offer.
Some good ideas in this thread.
I’d particularly like to see more focus on the animals and less on the guests.
For example - every single lion likes the same enrichment items as the next lion. Whereas I’ve heard zookeepers say - this lion hates the water, it the other one likes it this lion likes playing with a balL whereas the other one is lazier and likes smelling perfume on boxes etc. Would be nice to have to invest in the individual animal to create more of a ‘relationship’ rather than them seeming literally like a replaceable part of the architecture.
I think franchise has a bit of potential to run multiple zoo’s simultaneously and set up breeding programmes where you can follow family trees back multiple generations.
embrace the mods a bit more - appreciate this is hard but a slot for every person to ‘insert‘ their favourite mods to use for franchise for example would be a lot of fun.
and move the emphasis away from the guests - it’s frustrating to set up a beautiful enclosure or replicate an existing zoo where the guests don’t walk there because the zoo is too big for one entrance or they spend more time queueing for drinks than looking at the animals. It’s comfortably the most frustrating aspect of the game in my view. Appreciate you can turn some of that off in sandbox, but it’s more fun to have the option to play challenge and franchise.
great game - next iteration could definitely do with more emphasis on the stars of the show though imo.
I’d particularly like to see more focus on the animals and less on the guests.
For example - every single lion likes the same enrichment items as the next lion. Whereas I’ve heard zookeepers say - this lion hates the water, it the other one likes it this lion likes playing with a balL whereas the other one is lazier and likes smelling perfume on boxes etc. Would be nice to have to invest in the individual animal to create more of a ‘relationship’ rather than them seeming literally like a replaceable part of the architecture.
I think franchise has a bit of potential to run multiple zoo’s simultaneously and set up breeding programmes where you can follow family trees back multiple generations.
embrace the mods a bit more - appreciate this is hard but a slot for every person to ‘insert‘ their favourite mods to use for franchise for example would be a lot of fun.
and move the emphasis away from the guests - it’s frustrating to set up a beautiful enclosure or replicate an existing zoo where the guests don’t walk there because the zoo is too big for one entrance or they spend more time queueing for drinks than looking at the animals. It’s comfortably the most frustrating aspect of the game in my view. Appreciate you can turn some of that off in sandbox, but it’s more fun to have the option to play challenge and franchise.
great game - next iteration could definitely do with more emphasis on the stars of the show though imo.
Going to disagree with you here - I want the guests to be more interesting and less easy to cater to. I want both them and the animals to have personalities like people who only want to see the really popular animals, people who are really impatient with a view that isn't very up close versus those that like naturalistic environments and glimses willl satisfy them, guests that will really worry about animal welfare that isn't nearly perfect versus those that will put up with poor welfare etc. etc. I'd be very happy for this kind of thing to be toggleable and off by default in sandbox of course.
For me the central challenge of the game should be about balancing the needs of guests a and making money versus giving the animals great lives, breeding them and conservation. That is the tension that exists in real life and it is the only reason the actual design of a zoo would matter beyond aesthetics and I want it to matter. At the moment all you have to do to keep guests happy is to stick loads of food and water places around. I loved that in planco in the scenario editor you could change the guests so different personalities would be more prevalent so that the guests in one park might be much more challenging to please than in another. The animals are great and I want them to feel more indvidualistic but please don't encourage frontier to ignore the guests more than they already have for PZ1!
I'd love though if they wouldn't need to eat every 5 Minutes
Hi Cocolori, would certainly not suggest completely ignoring the guests. I probably didn’t articulate very well - what you describe in planco sounds interesting. I would favour guests having unique needs around the animals and habitats more than being food, drink and toilet focused. It feels like any realistic zoo build with authentic size and layout of habitats has to be compromised by a food and drink gathering between almost every habitat. if you space the habitats out to provide those guest facilities then the park becomes so large that most guests don’t visit beyond 20% near the entrance. Animal with most educational is almost invariably one near the start In my experience. Would be good to see guests ‘needs’ being more linked to animal happiness, great habitat layout etc than whether they can spend over 50% of their visit queuing for food and drink (I made this %age up, but just what it feels like).
that’s my view anyway, fully appreciate different aspects of the game appeal to different people.
that’s my view anyway, fully appreciate different aspects of the game appeal to different people.
you bring up alot of good points especially around community engagement such as player to player trading an visiting zoos. I do think the best solution to time is make it fully customisable with animals ageing, breeding and physical time being all separate sliders with more than 5 points. It is honestly annoying how short seasons are it is so painful to have protect your animals from the snow for what like 10 minutes more substantial seasons would add so much to the game.
The biggest issue with guest is travel time they rarely ever make it into the interior of big zoos no mater how many benches, food stalls and drinks are available this needs to be changed especially when the majority of players build huge habitats.
No PZ2...
Let's "polish" PZ!
I think PZ has potential to be perfection (I mean aside from the time going too fast...)
I’ve been looking for this comment!
I honestly just want PZ to Sims 4 it and come up with more and more updates and content
I know I’ll be sad when PZ2 comes out, I’ll just feel like all the DLCs and updates were a waste and we start at zero
I agree to some extent there are only so many bandaids you can slap on before everything falls apart they definitely should work on and improve PZ but there is a point where the problems are so entrenched into the system that there is no hope of fixing them. Ill take your sims 4 example even after almost 10 years and many countless improvements they still dont have cars or an open world and ill explain why this is significant to planet zoo. Cars represents something like say an exhibit update where it is easily possible but because the game wasnt designed from the begging for it it will break hundreds of save files because non of the lots in the sims have a direct connection to the road so how would cars work without a complete redo of the world. How would exhibits function is suddenly the spider couldnt be kept in a 4x4 box anymore of even if the 4x4 didnt exist. Now an open world represents the limits of a games engine what it can effective run and support both in terms of performance and features. This is what is limiting like better climbing, free flight birds, multiple habitat gates, terrain paint and just general performance of planet zoo since it is still running on the engine from planet coaster and yes engine upgrades are possible just very difficult.I’ve been looking for this comment!
I honestly just want PZ to Sims 4 it and come up with more and more updates and content
I know I’ll be sad when PZ2 comes out, I’ll just feel like all the DLCs and updates were a waste and we start at zero
I totally see you point here
I know the same arguments from the sims community and find the request for a sequel far more reasonable then expecting Frontier to completely change the core of PZ (which is a common request in sims players I feel like), so that I entirely see! I guess I’d really just want all the bandaids first so to speak. I’d prefer to have looped animation birds to have that aspect of the simulation to be complete and then 5 years down the line PZ2 can drop with improvements of HOW things are done, with a core that caters to these aspects from the beginning on and DLCs that always come with a bird!
I’d just hate to leave PZ feeling like it was never finished to be what it could be, aspecially when so many requests were taken into account and blew my mind with how much they are still willing to implement this far down the line.
Because staying in the sims realm: we never know if a sequel will be better or richer in content or speaking to the same player base, but a sequel most certainly means that the original won’t be touched for new content anymore
But mostly it terrifies me that it took years to build up the roster we have now and it’s still hard to limit a wishlist to 50 animals. So if PZ2 were to come out in 2 years we’d start again and again request things we had had before.
But I also recognise that it’s easy for me to say, because most things requested here are not things that would be that important to me or things that I can totally see to be within the reasonably possible for PZ (like improving the sandbox market)
My biggest and only fear with a sequel is the roster choice which animals will be excluded and how many future dlc slots will be taken by animals we have already seen but yes I would love to see as many fixes to pz as possible.I totally see you point here
I guess I’d really just want all the bandaids first so to speak. I’d prefer to have looped animation birds to have that aspect of the simulation to be complete and then 5 years down the line PZ2 can drop with improvements of HOW things are done, with a core that caters to these aspects from the beginning on and DLCs that always come with a bird!
I’d just hate to leave PZ feeling like it was never finished to be what it could be, aspecially when so many requests were taken into account and blew my mind with how much they are still willing to implement this far down the line.
Because staying in the sims realm: we never know if a sequel will be better or richer in content or speaking to the same player base, but a sequel most certainly means that the original won’t be touched for new content anymore
But mostly it terrifies me that it took years to build up the roster we have now and it’s still hard to limit a wishlist to 50 animals. So if PZ2 were to come out in 2 years we’d start again and again request things we had had before.
But I also recognise that it’s easy for me to say, because most things requested here are not things that would be that important to me or things that I can totally see to be within the reasonably possible for PZ (like improving the sandbox market)